The cricket thread

crunchman · February 2021

Stuckfast said:

That pitch actually suited quickish bowlers like Root and Axar Patel rather than the big spinners though. Kuldeep hardly bowled.

The ptich doesn't matter when you bowl full tosses.

Heartfeltdawn · February 2021

sixstringsupplies said:

^blessing in disguise. It's strange that you can get 8 wickets in the match and still be thought of as not bowling well.

Having played and adored cricket my whole life, I can not understand how a professional cricketer can be so inconsistent with the ball. As a professional bowler, you would have thought landing it on a decent line and length consistently should come naturally. This is not an attack on Moeen Ali, but Bess too, and all spinners since Swann retired. There must be a spinner on the first class circuit who bowls consistent line and length, or doesn't bowl the release ball once an over. The magic tricks can be developed. These guys gave been bowling spin for years, practicing in the nets day in day out to hone their skills.

How can they be so inconsistent?

This is why Leach is the best spinner - he is the most consistent, by far.

I wish Moeen Ali well, but his International career ended when he got dropped during the world cup group stages. A very talented player and elegant batsman when at his best but due to being mis-managed, shuffled, playing in too many roles (and subsequently not knowing his role or ever having a definitive role) he has always been a bit-part player showing glimpes of brilliance.

This England team are a world class spinner short of being a world class team.

I don't think it does come naturally because the right length for a bowler is an evolving process. Look at our leading Test wicket taker. At 24 Tests Jimmy was going at 3.84 runs per over. After 238 Tests (sic), it's down to 2.84 runs per over. He got better and more accurate as he honed his action. Some other players lose a bit of that command as they get older and injuries occur.

Also you get people like Leach who aren't bowling the same way as they were much younger. He had to remodel the action in 2016 because he was found to bend too much. Last year he started tweaking with the way he released the ball. You can see what is going on comparing his wrist position at release in 2018 versus the wrist position for the ball in the 1st Test that bowled Rohit Sharma. That plus the run up he uses now is trying to impart more revs onto the ball. It's a subtle change but it most definitely isn't the same way he was bowling as a kid and not what he's done naturally. that in turn has an impact on the control you have on the ball. Until you're fully comfortable with it, then it will feel awkward and you can have some lousy moments. The more he has bowled all winter, the better he has looked.

https://i.imgur.com/naWBBG5.png
https://i.imgur.com/af1d0GK.png

earwighoney · February 2021

Stuckfast said:

I thought Mo bowled more consistently in the second Test than Bess did in the first. He looked rusty in the first innings but didn't bowl many bad balls in the second.

Also, Bess got five-for in the first Sri Lanka Test bowling an absolute heap of shite.

Like Gaz Ballance with the bat. His average wasn't bad but his technique was horrible.

Heartfeltdawn · February 2021

earwighoney said:
Like Gaz Ballance with the bat. His average wasn't bad but his technique was horrible.

Or Allan Border getting a 10-fer...

Stuckfast · February 2021

F*** me that's horrific.

Let's not forget India have a track record of collapsing against part-time spinners...

Heartfeltdawn · February 2021

And that match also means we shouldn't forget how Australia have a track record in collapsing chasing small totals...

India 104 all out.
Australia 203 all out.
India 205 all out.
Australia 93 all out.

The whole match lasted just over 200 overs and was done in three days despite day 1 being rain delayed and only 11 overs being bowled.

rocktron · February 2021

I know that this is a hypothetical situation, but I wonder how the Indian batsmen would have fared against their own spin bowlers on that pitch.

crunchman · February 2021

rocktron said:

I know that this is a hypothetical situation, but I wonder how the Indian batsmen would have fared against their own spin bowlers on that pitch.

Batting first or batting second? Getting first use of the pitch on day one helped them as well.

crunchman · February 2021

Bounce looks a bit inconsistent based on the first over.

Probably a good toss to win.

scrumhalf · February 2021

Uh-oh, 27-2.

On the us side Zak is playing beautifully.

crunchman · February 2021

I'm still not convinced by Bairstow as a batsman. I would have stuck with Burns and played Crawley at 3. If Bairstow is going to play, it would be better to put Stokes up to 3 and Bairstow at 6.

Nitefly · February 2021

100-8? INCLUDING 53 from Crawley! Stone the bloody crows.

crunchman · February 2021

A couple of the LBWs that were given out against our better batsmen were umpires call. If they had been given the other way, it may well be a lot better.

I'm not sure the catch off Leach was clean either. The fielder got his hands under it initially but it looked to me like it went through his hands and hit the ground before he scooped it up. It's a pity there wasn't a better camera angle.

Even though England haven't got the rub of the green, it hasn't been a good batting performance. In some ways the most worrying dismissal was Sibley's. If he doesn't fix that thing of the bat coming through from slip to mid on he's going to get eaten alive by test quality quick bowlers.

Neill · February 2021

With Archer at No 8 the specialist batsmen had better perform.

And I'm not convinced about Archer. He doesn't bowl consistently at speed yet that's what he's there for. Mark Wood always looks like he has to try too hard. Olly Stone is the real deal in my book.

crunchman · February 2021

Look on the bright side. Anderson and Broad are likely to get to bowl in the twilight with a nice new ball.

scrumhalf · February 2021

I'd like to think this is a cunning plan to skittle India out under the lights.

Stuckfast · February 2021

Flip's sake. How many batsmen have basically just missed a straight one?

I think the jury is still out on Archer as a bowler, but I do worry that England place too much faith in his batting. Why on earth is he coming in ahead of Leach?

guitars4you · February 2021

so far 10 wickets have fallen to spin on the first day of a test

a) when was the last time this happened - No need to answer as such as I'm sure it has - Just more of a silly observation and an hour or so still to play
b) just a strong hunch - Have we misread the pitch and picked the wrong line up

Neill · February 2021

guitars4you said:

so far 10 wickets have fallen to spin on the first day of a test

a) when was the last time this happened - No need to answer as such as I'm sure it has - Just more of a silly observation and an hour or so still to play
b) just a strong hunch - Have we misread the pitch and picked the wrong line up

Well if Anderson and Broad don't get five wickets each we are going to look pretty silly, if we don't already.

England cricket seems to have the same disease as the rugby establishment, everything revolves around certain star players who they can't bear to drop. Going into this game with one recognised spinner just so they could play Anderson and Broad.

I think this game could also be make or break for Jofra Archer - does anyone else think he just isn't that keen on test cricket? If he doesn't start making the Indians jump about a bit I can see the selectors losing patience, especially with Stone making such an impression.

Stuckfast · February 2021

Leach has been poor so far. He's basically served up a buffet of half-volleys with the occasional short one. Axar Patel by comparison hit a good length practically every ball.

guitars4you · February 2021

91-2 and a stumping appeal - Root annoyed after the 3rd umpires decision and I think he is right to be so - Roll the tape on a touch more and I'm sure you can see the foot come down further , so it must have higher before hand, hence out

Easy drop catch just before from Pope off Anderson - Not our day

Stuckfast · February 2021

Thank heaven for that Kohli wicket. Leach bowled a lot better once he switched ends. Surprised they took Anderson off, he was bowling really well.

crunchman · February 2021

guitars4you said:

91-2 and a stumping appeal - Root annoyed after the 3rd umpires decision and I think he is right to be so - Roll the tape on a touch more and I'm sure you can see the foot come down further , so it must have higher before hand, hence out

Easy drop catch just before from Pope off Anderson - Not our day

Third umpire hasn't been good. He overturned the catch Stokes made earlier - probably correctly - but didn't overturn the one where Leach was given out. That one definitely looked like it hit the ground. If he's consistent in giving the batsman the benefit, then fine, but he didn't with Leach.

sixstringsupplies · February 2021

The on field umpiring has been top notch but the 3rd umpiring has been atrocious, for both sides, all series. A very simple process should be followed....and it is not.

Very poor performance from England with the bat, but they are not completely dead in the water.

If they can knock India over without their lead going above 70ish....game on.

Big ask though. Would help if you didn't feel like you had to get each batsman out twice.

I actually though the Stokes catch was dropped in real time, and the replays suggested it was grounded.

Sharma probably was not not, but the fact it wasn't fully checked is infuriating.

I would have been upset if I woke up at 4am to watch that!

Heartfeltdawn · February 2021

crunchman said:

Even though England haven't got the rub of the green, it hasn't been a good batting performance. In some ways the most worrying dismissal was Sibley's. If he doesn't fix that thing of the bat coming through from slip to mid on he's going to get eaten alive by test quality quick bowlers.

When he's there waiting for the bowler to arrive, if you view him from side on then before the ball is bowled his hands come forward toward the bowler, then back toward the keeper, and then he brings the bat out to the slips and across. This was the same against the slow bowlers in Sri Lanka. If he swings a golf club in the same manner then he must get through a shitload of Titleist.

Stuckfast said:

Flip's sake. How many batsmen have basically just missed a straight one?

It's what happens when you get batsmen spooked into thinking every single one will turn. Witness Ian Bell trying to play Warne in 2005.

crunchman · February 2021

Heartfeltdawn said:

Stuckfast said:

Flip's sake. How many batsmen have basically just missed a straight one?

It's what happens when you get batsmen spooked into thinking every single one will turn. Witness Ian Bell trying to play Warne in 2005.

That's where they need better footwork though. If they can get to the pitch, then they should be able to cover the turn. I know it's easier said than done, but it's what the really good players of spin do.

Or go right back, to give yourself time to react. If the bowler starts to pitch up more to counter that, then go forwards.

Heartfeltdawn · February 2021

Stuckfast said:

Leach has been poor so far. He's basically served up a buffet of half-volleys with the occasional short one. Axar Patel by comparison hit a good length practically every ball.

Dew. Plain and simple.

Gotta laugh at today though.

"Hey Jack, here's the game plan. What we're going to do is to win the toss, pick the wrong bowling attack for this wicket, bat like tossers, get rolled, and then you've got to come out here and bowl as well as both of their spinners did against far better batsmen than they bowled against and you've got to do it when the dew is out and you can't grip the ball as well as their guys could earlier in the day. OK with that?"

guitars4you · February 2021

crunchman said:

guitars4you said:

91-2 and a stumping appeal - Root annoyed after the 3rd umpires decision and I think he is right to be so - Roll the tape on a touch more and I'm sure you can see the foot come down further , so it must have higher before hand, hence out

Easy drop catch just before from Pope off Anderson - Not our day

Third umpire hasn't been good. He overturned the catch Stokes made earlier - probably correctly - but didn't overturn the one where Leach was given out. That one definitely looked like it hit the ground. If he's consistent in giving the batsman the benefit, then fine, but he didn't with Leach.

I agree that I thought the Stokes decision was correct - But I thought Leach was out as well - But often awkward such issues with camera angles etc

Stuckfast · February 2021

Heartfeltdawn said:

Stuckfast said:

Leach has been poor so far. He's basically served up a buffet of half-volleys with the occasional short one. Axar Patel by comparison hit a good length practically every ball.

Dew. Plain and simple.

Swann said on commentary there was no dew at all.

earwighoney · February 2021

Heartfeltdawn said:

"Hey Jack, here's the game plan. What we're going to do is to win the toss, pick the wrong bowling attack for this wicket, bat like tossers, get rolled, and then you've got to come out here and bowl as well as both of their spinners did against far better batsmen than they bowled against and you've got to do it when the dew is out and you can't grip the ball as well as their guys could earlier in the day. OK with that?"

3 seamers and one spinner is a strange decision for any Indian wicket, maybe aside from Kolkata.

Howdy, Stranger!

Categories

In this Discussion

Become a Subscriber!

The cricket thread

Comments