The cricket thread

Mellish · January 2022

@Teetonetal ; well they didn't. But it's jolly old pals from what I can see. You have players who would love to get in the Test squad, love to play for their country cos it'd be an honour and a privilege but they'll never be selected cos this lot from selectors to Silverwood on down stick together. I may be wrong but that's how it looks to me

crunchman · January 2022

Mellish said:

@Teetonetal ; well they didn't. But it's jolly old pals from what I can see. You have players who would love to get in the Test squad, love to play for their country cos it'd be an honour and a privilege but they'll never be selected cos this lot from selectors to Silverwood on down stick together. I may be wrong but that's how it looks to me

Selection needs to be at least partially independent of coaching. A coach needs to be able to get alongside the players and work with them. If the player knows that the coach is likely to be the one wielding the axe, it might make it difficult to open up to the coach. On the other side, it's too easy for a coach to play favourites. You do have to be aware of team dynamics, and you don't want another Pietersen situation, but there needs to be someone independent who can tell the coach "this bloke is too good to leave out."

The coach needs to have some input. If you do have a Pietersen causing havoc in the dressing room, the coach needs to be able to say so, but there needs to be someone independent of the dressing room involved.

The other problem with the current arrangement is that Silverwood is too busy with the England team to watch any county cricket. How does he assess potential players?

crunchman · January 2022

@axisus posted this in the Friday humour thread. Don't know if everyone in this thread follows that one, so I thought I would post it here as well:

Mellish · January 2022

That is funny

Heartfeltdawn · January 2022

When England reached 50-0 in the Hobart Test second knock, Bet365 were offering doubles or nothing on either side to win. Quite remarkable faith from the bookies given our propensity to collapse. I'd racked up about £50 in small bets from the series and threw £25 on Australia to win. England delivered so the question is this: it is really gambling if you're putting money on England to collapse?

Heartfeltdawn · January 2022

And to continue a trend but with prettier individuals...*

England Women lost by 9 wickets in their first game.
England Women A lost by 10 wickets in their first game.

A thought: if both sides get trashed this winter in Australia, should we blame County Championship wickets for the women being crap too?

*excluding the long beautiful hair of Rory Burns.

scrumhalf · January 2022

Well, it's contagious.

The T20 team get walloped as well. Too much red ball cricket?

Or maybe half-arsed planning, expecting a team to fly halfway round the world and hit their straps immediately. We've not come across that one before, have we?

crunchman · January 2022

I didn't even know there was a match on. That's how important T20 is as far as I'm concerned.

Mellish · January 2022

Travelling to Oz, more or less jumping straight into the Ashes without warm-up matches, that can be a plausible excuse for losing the first Test and maybe the second but three, four and five? And what about at home, where we haven't won the Ashes since 2001- what's the excuse there? Oh yeah, "Lessons will be learned"

crunchman · January 2022

Mellish said:

Travelling to Oz, more or less jumping straight into the Ashes without warm-up matches, that can be a plausible excuse for losing the first Test and maybe the second but three, four and five? And what about at home, where we haven't won the Ashes since 2001- what's the excuse there? Oh yeah, "Lessons will be learned"

You seem to be forgetting 2005, 2009, and 2013.

Mellish · January 2022

Well, yes, but in my defence I did say earlier that my sporting career was as a club cyclist whose cricket knowledge is limited to a love of watching. That said, even to me it's obvious that the current England Test team is rubbish

Mellish · January 2022

The last time we won the Ashes was 1985, that's what I'm getting from a Google search. Retaining and winning are different, right?

crunchman · January 2022

Mellish said:

The last time we won the Ashes was 1985, that's what I'm getting from a Google search. Retaining and winning are different, right?

Retaining and winning are different, but we have won quite a few times since 1984/85.

I actually forgot 2015 before. We won that one 3-2.

We won 3-0 in 2013.

We won 3-1 away in the winter of 2010-11 when Cook had a monster series.

We won 2-1 in 2009

We won 2-1 in the now legendary 2005 series.

Mellish · January 2022

But something has gone very wrong. Selectors, Silverwood, too much focus on other forms, I don't know but something. As a small boy, the England Test team were my heroes. But this lot, I wouldn't go along and pay to watch if my life depended on it. Guts, fire, determination, that's what I want to see

sixstringsupplies · January 2022

Going to watch a day at the test this summer and I’m already hoping it rains and we get to sit in the pub all day at Edgbaston.

Last summer James Bracey was keeper, didn’t get a run and dropped 2 catches. Crawley top scored with about 18 and the only entertainment was watching the madness in the Hollies stand. I felt short changed to say the least. Kane Williamson and Stokes were injured, though I got to see both teams bat.

None of the stars bar Root and Anderson were playing, the others were rested having been at the IPL. (Woakes didn’t even get a game in the IPL, though was rested nonetheless)

I note that some England players have withdrawn from the IPL auction this year, which is a good start. Stokes and Root are going to concentrate on playing the CC this summer.

I’m not going to blame the pitches in the CC, because I’d have though if you can bat half decent on a wobbler, then flat pitches should be easier.

Is there an argument that Jimmy has prospered in recent years due to a general decline in test match batting? The sky sports pundits were (rightly) critical of England batting, but argued Australia batting is fragile, NZ got bowled out for 60 odd recently. India get rolled over often. By that logic, not one test battling lineup can be described as “solid”.

The whole setup stinks and I can’t even blame the cricketers. The ECB on the other hand…

The ICC really need to get their heads on - white ball cricket is entertaining, but after a certain point (like now) it becomes saturated.

barely three months after the WT2020 World Cup, the groups have been announced for the next one later this year.

All well and good, but if test cricket falls, the other formats will follow suit quite quickly I reckon!

crunchman · January 2022

sixstringsupplies said:

I’m not going to blame the pitches in the CC, because I’d have though if you can bat half decent on a wobbler, then flat pitches should be easier.

The argument is that you won't last long on a pitch like that so you play your shots and hope to get 30 or 40 before you get out. Batsman don't set their stall out to bat all day because they can't anyway.

The bigger issue with those kind of pitches might be what kind of bowling it encourages. Medium paced dobbers are very effective, so there is no incentive for bowlers to bowl fast. Counties are unlikely to select a quicker bowler who might spray it about a bit, as they can select a medium pacer who is more accurate. Spin bowlers are marginalised as well. At test level, you want decent spinners and proper fast bowlers.

sixstringsupplies · January 2022

^yes that’s right - I think it was Ian Ward or Steve Finn who had texted a number of their playing mates who all said that in the CC you play to get to 20 or 30 as quickly as possible as there is always a ball with your name on it.

Ok fine - I’ll blame the pitches too.

Jonathangus · February 2022

Ashley Giles has gone:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/60237871

crunchman · February 2022

Jonathangus said:

Ashley Giles has gone:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/60237871

Replaced by Strauss for the moment. Wasn't Strauss responsible for the abomination that is the Hundred in his previous stint?

Heartfeltdawn · February 2022

The King of Spain takes the fall. Reports elsewhere say that Giles was tasked with getting England through a fucking mental fixture list. Cricket Twitter has been pulling the 'Silverwood must be sacked' shit for weeks and it's outstandingly boring. It doesn't matter who was coach of this tour. The coach isn't responsible for the direction of English and Welsh domestic cricket over the last few years. They don't draw up fixture lists or create innovative new short format tournaments (cough sarcasm etc). You could have had Bob Simpson managing this tour with a robocoach made from Brearley and Fletcher braincell DNA and we'd have lost.

crunchman said:

Jonathangus said:

Ashley Giles has gone:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/60237871

Replaced by Strauss for the moment. Wasn't Strauss responsible for the abomination that is the Hundred in his previous stint?

He started the tilt in direction toward 50-over success and was involved in the Hundred. Possibility of Stewart coming in as interim coach if Silverwood goes.

crunchman · February 2022

Silverwood has to go. To come out after the second test, and insist that they had picked the right teams shows such a complete lack of awareness that his position is completely untenable.

If he had said "we misread the conditions, and would pick a different team with hindsight" then you could have had a bit of sympathy with him. To insist that he would pick the same teams again though was a total joke.

Mellish · February 2022

I agree that Silverwood has to go but BBC Sport says that his future is "Unclear". What a mess it is

Heartfeltdawn · February 2022

crunchman said:

Silverwood has to go. To come out after the second test, and insist that they had picked the right teams shows such a complete lack of awareness that his position is completely untenable.

If he had said "we misread the conditions, and would pick a different team with hindsight" then you could have had a bit of sympathy with him. To insist that he would pick the same teams again though was a total joke.

Deckchair/Titanic. Wrong selections, sure but he's hardly the only coach to have done that. Focusing on the coach as a lot of Twitter folk have done totally misses the fundamental failings within every single segment of our domestic game.

pedalo · February 2022

I’m contemplating whether or not to get a Yorkshire membership this year.

On the one hand, some positive action has been taken but on the other I’m worried that it will still be a bit of a toxic atmosphere in the crowd amongst the old guard and lads that cricket attracts.

earwighoney · February 2022

Heartfeltdawn said:

Deckchair/Titanic. Wrong selections, sure but he's hardly the only coach to have done that. Focusing on the coach as a lot of Twitter folk have done totally misses the fundamental failings within every single segment of our domestic game.

If someone has chronic diarrhoea (after drinking bad water) and keeps on shitting themselves, not only should they change their underwear but they should take some medication and stop drinking bad water.

Replacing Silverwood/Giles is just changing the day's underwear, whilst continuing to drink bad water and not taking any medication.

pedalo · February 2022

pedalo said:

I’m contemplating whether or not to get a Yorkshire membership this year.

On the one hand, some positive action has been taken but on the other I’m worried that it will still be a bit of a toxic atmosphere in the crowd amongst the old guard and lads that cricket attracts.

Ffs just seen the latest news on board wranglings. Glad I didn’t get a membership just yet. It’s gonna come down to a Brexit type vote amongst the membership that could drastically change the future of the club.

chris78 · February 2022

I presume England don’t want to win in the West Indies with the squad they picked?

guitars4you · February 2022

chris78 said:

I presume England don’t want to win in the West Indies with the squad they picked?

Yes just seen no Broad or Anderson - To be fair, I was expecting both to retire after the Ashes tour - The Ashes, home/away, is often seen as the target to aim for and with the Aussies not due here until 2023, so 2 years away, is it time for them to call it a day - Granted we are not in a strong position, but it can't be to far away before they are gone anyway

Heartfeltdawn · February 2022

Brilliant on the JA-SB non-selection. It's time to see if some of the first changers can be outright openers. Time to deliver overseas, Mr Woakes. Mark Wood: can he go from undoubted effort to man of effort and wickets early doors? Ollie Robinson: he has the talent with the ball, can he get the fitness right?

Root to 3 is interesting as is the possibility of Stokes at 4. I understand not wanting to have 3 young ones 1-3.

Liking the selection and the challenges put up so far.

sev112 · February 2022

And the batting replacements are ?

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