The Rugby Union Thread

rsvmark · December 2019

The panel who judged Howley found that from 14 November, 2015 to 7 September, 2019 he put "363 bets on rugby union, featuring 1,163 matches in total".

....and lost £4000...... reads like a sad story than any ‘wrong doing’ to me. And he lost out on the Italy job. Feel a bit sorry for him actually

mattdavis · December 2019

I feel sorry for him too - and it seems there is a very sad back story if the article is correct. My initial reaction was a bit more accusing along the lines of ‘WTF did he think would happen?!’ But it’s probably a conscious or unconscious self sabotaging behaviour.

Gassage · January 2020

So, my next big interview- the most talented player I have ever seen and a titan of the game-

Mr Sergio Parisse.

I am absolutely bowled over that he's agreed to a 2000 word no holds barred piece, the first he's ever given to a UK journo.

rsvmark · January 2020

Gassage said:

So, my next big interview- the most talented player I have ever seen and a titan of the game-

Mr Sergio Parisse.

I am absolutely bowled over that he's agreed to a 2000 word no holds barred piece, the first he's ever given to a UK journo.

Bowled over? You’ll be wanting the cricket thread mate.

congrats- look forward to reading it

mattdavis · January 2020

Gassage said:

So, my next big interview- the most talented player I have ever seen and a titan of the game-

Mr Sergio Parisse.

I am absolutely bowled over that he's agreed to a 2000 word no holds barred piece, the first he's ever given to a UK journo.

I’m pretty sure I remember reading posts where he was the object of your rugby - and aesthetic - admiration. I look forward to a balanced, Warts and all exposé :-)

nice one James. Look forward to reading it.

fretmeister · January 2020

Sarries cap breach again!

https://www.rugbypass.com/news/saracens-stand-on-brink-of-automatic-relegation-as-nightmare-season-set-to-continue/

scrumhalf · January 2020

I remain to be convinced that they won't somehow weasel their way out of this.

Is there a salary cap in the Championship?

rsvmark · January 2020

Interesting. So the attempts to reduce salaries hasn’t achieved the target to get them within the cap despite best efforts. Hmmmm. Try harder? Release players. Well that’s one side of it.

But on the other hand, I can’t help that an imposed relegation will do nothing for the game. I mean they trounced my team, they won last week with 14 men after 4 minutes. All that will happen is that they will have an exodus of players and yet still spank everyone in the championship.

While I certainly don’t condone their approach (and they won’t give a shit about my opinion anyway) I can’t help thinking that the whole affair is a bit of a shame. Like them, or loathe them, they are one hell of a team over the last few seasons. I have kept one of the games from a season or so ago on my sky +..... it was simply one of the most titanic games I have ever seen.

There you go- candidate for my most useless post ever

fretmeister · January 2020

I wonder if leaving payoffs / buying players out of the contract counts towards the cap.

crunchman · January 2020

fretmeister said:

I wonder if leaving payoffs / buying players out of the contract counts towards the cap.

Yes it does from what I've read - which is why they have no way to get under the cap.

scrumhalf · January 2020

I assume that all club salaries contribute to the cap, otherwise they might have some very well paid canteen staff.

The game has always had issues where player payments are concerned, from shamateurism to boot money to players getting jobs at a director's company. But the sheer brass neck of repeated "we've done nothing wrong, they only hate us because we win everything" takes the biscuit.

I feel sorry for Exeter, who may have been champions many more times than they have been.

fretmeister · January 2020

scrumhalf said:

I assume that all club salaries contribute to the cap, otherwise they might have some very well paid canteen staff.

The game has always had issues where player payments are concerned, from shamateurism to boot money to players getting jobs at a director's company. But the sheer brass neck of repeated "we've done nothing wrong, they only hate us because we win everything" takes the biscuit.

I feel sorry for Exeter, who may have been champions many more times than they have been.

Not just Exeter. If say 4 of the best Sarries players were elsewhere it changes the dynamics of the top of the entire prem.

snakemanStoo · January 2020

SAracens will be relgated at the end of the season

BBC Link
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/51164177

fretmeister · January 2020

Good.

rsvmark · January 2020

Watch this space then for player exodus and invoking relegation clauses in their contracts

fretmeister · January 2020

Wow.

It was Sarries own choice to take relegation or open their books....

https://twitter.com/chjones9/status/1218621673856995328?s=21

Hiding something!

koneguitarist · January 2020

Can imagine a few going to France on 2 year contracts to be back in time for a season before next World Cup.

scrumhalf · January 2020

I feel sorry for some of their fans, but not those who claim that the whole thing has been orchestrated out of jealousy of their success. There are some threads on their fan forums that veer between hysteria, paranoia and delusion.

Now for HMRC to get involved.

As a fan of Wasps, who have been bloody awful for most of this season, I can't say I'm not happy at the thought of relegation no loner being a possibility.

rsvmark · January 2020

scrumhalf said:

I feel sorry for some of their fans, but not those who claim that the whole thing has been orchestrated out of jealousy of their success. There are some threads on their fan forums that veer between hysteria, paranoia and delusion.

Now for HMRC to get involved.

As a fan of Wasps, who have been bloody awful for most of this season, I can't say I'm not happy at the thought of relegation no loner being a possibility.

Claiming this is orchestrated is a delusional conspiracy theory. Sorry.

As for Relegation, these are unprecedented times. Might we see two teams relegated?

tbm · January 2020

Sarries are, unsurprisingly, looking in the mood to open up a can of whoopass. Apparently if the get a win with no BP they'll be travelling to Leinster. I do not want to see that.

rsvmark · January 2020

tbm said:

Sarries are, unsurprisingly, looking in the mood to open up a can of whoopass. Apparently if the get a win with no BP they'll be travelling to Leinster. I do not want to see that.

I was guessing this might happen....

tbm · January 2020

FFS! Some reward for finishing tops seeds. Sarries in the quarters....

fretmeister · January 2020

PRL is going to release the full report!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/51209973

rsvmark · January 2020

fretmeister said:

PRL is going to release the full report!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/51209973

Not according to the Guardian- Darren Child's is quoted saying that they (prl) would like to publish but consent has not been given... sarries lawyers apparently.... although why they need their consent is rather odd. Let’s see shall we?

rsvmark · January 2020

On another note, I am picking up rumours that other clubs have been ‘borderline’ at best in the past. Does anyone know how squeaky clean other clubs have been in recent years?

fretmeister · January 2020

rsvmark said:

fretmeister said:

PRL is going to release the full report!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/51209973

Not according to the Guardian- Darren Child's is quoted saying that they (prl) would like to publish but consent has not been given... sarries lawyers apparently.... although why they need their consent is rather odd. Let’s see shall we?

That was this morning.
From the article:

"Premiership Rugby will release the report into Saracens' breaches of the league's salary cap.

The move comes after the defending champions said they were "keen" for the report to be published in full."

Sarries have since said they want it out there!
I wonder if different people at Sarries are giving different statements.

scrumhalf · January 2020

It's easy to call for the publishing of a report that you know won't be published to try and make yourself lok better.

From memory, both Wasps and Quins voluntarily disclosed minor infringements. In Wasps' case our punishment was to not allow us to tackle properly, ensuring that for the past few seasons we've conceded a try bonus point's worth of ponits on average per game.

rsvmark · January 2020

fretmeister said:
Sarries have since said they want it out there!
I wonder if different people at Sarries are giving different statements.

Your finger is more on the pulse than mine. Different people giving different statements in a rapidly moving story is entirely feasible.

@scrumhalf - were any sanctions dished out to Wasps and Quins at the time?

Rocker · January 2020

Is there a salary cap in football? Or horse racing? Or F1? Of course not. So what is so special or fragile in the world of professional rugby that a salary cap is deemed necessary?

This whole sorry mess is the result of a salary cap that IMHO is needless and the result of small minded and short term thinking.

Blaendulais · January 2020

Rocker said:

Is there a salary cap in football? Or horse racing? Or F1? Of course not. So what is so special or fragile in the world of professional rugby that a salary cap is deemed necessary?

This whole sorry mess is the result of a salary cap that IMHO is needless and the result of small minded and short term thinking.

The sport is so financially unsound thats why. Inflated wages, low crowds sponsorship tiny. The 2 or 3 clubs with rich owners will bankrupt the game.

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