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India Moon Landing...

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  • GoFishGoFish Frets: 1082
    edited August 2023
    Ten years too late and still getting it wrong
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  • JfingersJfingers Frets: 283
    Jfingers said:
    Is it for a new Scammers Call Centre.... Good morning this is Microshaft calling from the Moon, your computer is infected with a virus, press 1 to speak to Captain Kork , Press 2 for Accounts 

    I'm dreadfully sorry, there doesn't appear to be a prick button available.
    Is that aimed at me ?

    I'm dreadfully sorry but yes it was. I have many Indian friends and they are sick of that type of casual racism and build a corner shop bollocks as well. Any more questions?
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  • ChalkyChalky Frets: 6460
    edited August 2023
    Jfingers said:
    Jfingers said:
    Is it for a new Scammers Call Centre.... Good morning this is Microshaft calling from the Moon, your computer is infected with a virus, press 1 to speak to Captain Kork , Press 2 for Accounts 

    I'm dreadfully sorry, there doesn't appear to be a prick button available.
    Is that aimed at me ?

    I'm dreadfully sorry but yes it was. I have many Indian friends and they are sick of that type of casual racism and build a corner shop bollocks as well. Any more questions?
    Is it racist to recognise how Mumbai pretty much cornered the market in UK business offshore call centres in the last couple of decades?  It isn't a cultural reference, more a testament to their business success in this area.
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  • Jfingers said:
    Jfingers said:
    Is it for a new Scammers Call Centre.... Good morning this is Microshaft calling from the Moon, your computer is infected with a virus, press 1 to speak to Captain Kork , Press 2 for Accounts 

    I'm dreadfully sorry, there doesn't appear to be a prick button available.
    Is that aimed at me ?

    I'm dreadfully sorry but yes it was. I have many Indian friends and they are sick of that type of casual racism and build a corner shop bollocks as well. Any more questions?
    I am not sure how you can call this racist, simply a joke about Call Centres. I suppose all the Payback scammers on You tube are also racist. All the call centre scammers seem to come from India and thats a fact. 

    Who is the Prick Now ! 


    “Ken sent me.”
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  • And from another thread on this very good forum 

    "That video of them scamming a 13 year old girl just shows they give absolutely zero fucks."


    “Ken sent me.”
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  • swillerswiller Frets: 662
    I think its cool.. To solve some of the problems with poverty, surely one of the things is to get itself on the map, increase interest and investment in the country. Perhaps it will reap rewards for the indian economy, international perception etc.

    If that was half paid for by UK taxpayers, its money better spent than the long list of wasted money by this current tory govt. 75mil total cost? bargain. Thats single premiership football player money. Makes it even more impressive.

    First thing that farage said was we should stop aid after this was annouced which says it all the racist cunt.
    Sure there are higher priorities at home, but there is a big fucking list of back burner into tory hands from UK taxper money which eclipses the small amount we give to india.

    Im with Jfingers on this. 
    Dont worry, be silly.
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  • OffsetOffset Frets: 9212
    Chalky said:
    Jfingers said:
    Jfingers said:
    Is it for a new Scammers Call Centre.... Good morning this is Microshaft calling from the Moon, your computer is infected with a virus, press 1 to speak to Captain Kork , Press 2 for Accounts 

    I'm dreadfully sorry, there doesn't appear to be a prick button available.
    Is that aimed at me ?

    I'm dreadfully sorry but yes it was. I have many Indian friends and they are sick of that type of casual racism and build a corner shop bollocks as well. Any more questions?
    Is it racist to recognise how Mumbai pretty much cornered the market in UK business offshore call centres in the last couple of decades?  It isn't a cultural reference, more a testament to their business success in this area.
    Indeed so.  And neither is it racist to point out how many scams originate from offshore blag farms.

    Next thing you'll tell us is that there are no Nigerian princes asking for funds to liberate their millions.
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  • Winny_PoohWinny_Pooh Frets: 7202
    Offset said:
    Chalky said:
    Jfingers said:
    Jfingers said:
    Is it for a new Scammers Call Centre.... Good morning this is Microshaft calling from the Moon, your computer is infected with a virus, press 1 to speak to Captain Kork , Press 2 for Accounts 

    I'm dreadfully sorry, there doesn't appear to be a prick button available.
    Is that aimed at me ?

    I'm dreadfully sorry but yes it was. I have many Indian friends and they are sick of that type of casual racism and build a corner shop bollocks as well. Any more questions?
    Is it racist to recognise how Mumbai pretty much cornered the market in UK business offshore call centres in the last couple of decades?  It isn't a cultural reference, more a testament to their business success in this area.
    Indeed so.  And neither is it racist to point out how many scams originate from offshore blag farms.

    Next thing you'll tell us is that there are no Nigerian princes asking for funds to liberate their millions.
    Sure, but what the fuck do scam callers have to do with a moon landing?! Nada, except they vaguely share the same country of over a billion people. It's a snidey weaselly comment. No need to defend it. 
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  • stufisherstufisher Frets: 612
    The best thing I've read that explains what India is and how it works is The White Tiger by Aravind Adiga.

    If you haven't read it then I commend it to you:

    https://www.britannica.com/topic/The-White-Tiger
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  • OffsetOffset Frets: 9212
    Indeed so.  And neither is it racist to point out how many scams originate from offshore blag farms.

    Next thing you'll tell us is that there are no Nigerian princes asking for funds to liberate their millions.
    Sure, but what the fuck do scam callers have to do with a moon landing?! Nada, except they vaguely share the same country of over a billion people. It's a snidey weaselly comment. No need to defend it. 
    Snidey?  Weaselly?!  You cut me to the quick.

    The original point - which you haven't referenced and which has been made in countless other posts - is that the yawning chasm between rich and poor in India is getting ever wider and little has been done to address it.  This doesn't sit well with spending gazillions on a moon landing which will have zero impact on India's population (or populations anywhere else in the world for that matter).  It's political posturing.

    Ever been to a large Indian city?  Try Delhi.  Abject poverty and life and death on the pavement sit side by side with unbelievable wealth.  And then try justifying sticking a bloody lander on the moon.
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  • TanninTannin Frets: 4394
    ^ You obviously don't live in the UK then. (Which is the same bar degree, and it is working hard on closing the gap.)
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  • SporkySporky Frets: 23802
    Offset said:
    Indeed so.  And neither is it racist to point out how many scams originate from offshore blag farms.
    It's not racist to acknowledge that there are Indian call centres that try to scam people.

    It is racist to extrapolate that to suggest that all Indians are scammers or that everything India as a nation does is in order to scam people. Just as it is to suggest that India as a nation went to the moon to open a corner shop. 
    "[Sporky] brings a certain vibe and dignity to the forum."
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  • OffsetOffset Frets: 9212
    Sporky said:
    Offset said:
    Indeed so.  And neither is it racist to point out how many scams originate from offshore blag farms.
    It's not racist to acknowledge that there are Indian call centres that try to scam people.

    It is racist to extrapolate that to suggest that all Indians are scammers or that everything India as a nation does is in order to scam people. Just as it is to suggest that India as a nation went to the moon to open a corner shop. 
    Agreed, but nobody was suggesting that (until now) :-)
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  • OffsetOffset Frets: 9212
    Tannin said:
    ^ You obviously don't live in the UK then. (Which is the same bar degree, and it is working hard on closing the gap.)
    It's heading in the wrong direction, yep.  But the 'degree' you mention is a fucking large one.
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  • DefaultMDefaultM Frets: 6724
    Guys don’t worry I’ve asked ChatGPT

    Is it racist to imply India went to the moon to open a scammers call centre?

    Yes, implying that India went to the moon solely to open a scam call center is indeed offensive and racist. It perpetuates negative stereotypes and is disrespectful towards India's scientific achievements. It's important to engage in respectful discussions and avoid spreading misinformation or offensive content.

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  • DefaultMDefaultM Frets: 6724
    What about if you write a little skit to go with it where an Indian person is making a scam call?

    Creating a skit that includes an Indian person making a scam call could be seen as offensive and insensitive, as it reinforces harmful stereotypes. It's important to avoid content that promotes discrimination or mocks a specific group of people based on nationality or ethnicity. Instead, consider creating content that is respectful and inclusive of all cultures.

    Who would have thought? Absolute madness. Can’t say anything these days.
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  • SporkySporky Frets: 23802
    Offset said:
    Sporky said:
    It's not racist to acknowledge that there are Indian call centres that try to scam people.

    It is racist to extrapolate that to suggest that all Indians are scammers or that everything India as a nation does is in order to scam people. Just as it is to suggest that India as a nation went to the moon to open a corner shop. 
    Agreed, but nobody was suggesting that (until now) :-)
    What about the rest of the sentence? 
    "[Sporky] brings a certain vibe and dignity to the forum."
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  • ColsCols Frets: 6405
    DefaultM said:
    Guys don’t worry I’ve asked ChatGPT

    Is it racist to imply India went to the moon to open a scammers call centre?

    Yes, implying that India went to the moon solely to open a scam call center is indeed offensive and racist. It perpetuates negative stereotypes and is disrespectful towards India's scientific achievements. It's important to engage in respectful discussions and avoid spreading misinformation or offensive content.

    That’s really unfair, people didn’t simply imply that India went to the moon to open a scammer’s call centre.

    There was, I recall, also an insinuation that they would be arguing “over whether to build a Sikh or Hindu temple or a Mosque at the landing site”.

    Just harmless bantz, innit?
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  • OffsetOffset Frets: 9212
    edited August 2023
    Sporky said:
    Offset said:
    Sporky said:
    It's not racist to acknowledge that there are Indian call centres that try to scam people.

    It is racist to extrapolate that to suggest that all Indians are scammers or that everything India as a nation does is in order to scam people. Just as it is to suggest that India as a nation went to the moon to open a corner shop. 
    Agreed, but nobody was suggesting that (until now) :-)
    What about the rest of the sentence? 
    -sigh-

    No-one was suggesting 'that everything India as a nation does is in order to scam people' either.
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  • DefaultMDefaultM Frets: 6724
    Offset said:
    Sporky said:
    Offset said:
    Sporky said:
    It's not racist to acknowledge that there are Indian call centres that try to scam people.

    It is racist to extrapolate that to suggest that all Indians are scammers or that everything India as a nation does is in order to scam people. Just as it is to suggest that India as a nation went to the moon to open a corner shop. 
    Agreed, but nobody was suggesting that (until now) :-)
    What about the rest of the sentence? 
    -sigh-

    No-one was suggesting 'that everything India as a nation does is in order to scam people' either.

    Our AI overlord has already ruled on this. Your insubordination has likely already been logged.
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  • SporkySporky Frets: 23802
    Offset said:
    -sigh-

    No-one was suggesting 'that everything India as a nation does is in order to scam people' either.
    Someone did however suggest that that was why they'd gone to the moon.

    Do you think that was a racist suggestion?

    Bonus points for wriggling out of the question again. 
    "[Sporky] brings a certain vibe and dignity to the forum."
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  • darthed1981darthed1981 Frets: 10322
    Guys, right, seriously.

    A lot of the jokes top of thread, while clearly meant as friendly, light humour and with no maliciousness, are racist. 

    They take stereotypes about India and use them to make jokes about things which are nothing to do with those stereotypes.  Yes, there are call centres for scams in India, there also are in the UK.  We have jokes about curry, jokes about expensive corner shops.  We have not covered ourselves in glory here.

    Imagine an Indian going....

    "Did you hear, British inventor Tim Berners-Lee just created a way of sharing information via computer called the world wide web?"

    "What's that for?  Tips on being fat, drunken, vulgar or violent slobs obsessed with a stupid dumb sport and who steal from and murder everyone wherever they go?"

    Might we maybe be a bit offended?  Despite the fact that globally, a lot of people see the British as fat, drunken vulgar or violent slobs obsessed with a dumb sport and historically mostly murderers, thieves and pirates?

    Are we genuinely going to argue that if an Indian fretboarder, or indeed as it's public, any Indian on the internet googled this and read this thread, they wouldn't be a bit offended?


    We have to be so very careful, what we believe in...
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  • JfingersJfingers Frets: 283
    I think I may have started this long standing argument by doing name calling.

    I didn't mean to cause a rift.

    My Indian friends have been slightly offended by things said in this thread, they understand however that casual racism was the norm in the old days and so just laugh at it and the perpetrators.
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  • DefaultMDefaultM Frets: 6724
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  • BillDLBillDL Frets: 5615
    I think one of the main issues that we have in "The West" is the imagery we usually see of India, for example the dangerous jumble of electrical cables criss-crossing streets, the hundreds of people clinging to the top and sides of trains, entrepeneurial but dirt poor people toiling away in small dirty spaces between buildings fashioning things from scrap metal, children sleeping on railway platforms, and so on.  India is far from being alone with these problems.  There are a lot of so-called "Third World Countries" or "Emerging Countries" with shanty towns, primitive and dangerous wiring, polluted communal water supplies, etc across the globe, and many of them also have a huge divide between rich and poor. That visual imagery belies how advanced India actually is in many other respects, but that same imagery is distracting and stays in our minds as we contemplate what the country has managed to achieve here.

    There is no doubt that lots of foreign aid and investment has allowed India to forge ahead with their lunar programme, and I wonder whether other nations like Nigeria may have been able to achieve the same results (apparently against all odds) had they been taken much more seriously and been able to garner even more more international aid and some other foreign  investment (primarily China and Russia).  An example is the Nigerian Space Programme that has been successful to a point with satellites up there that have helped with disaster response and so on, but it looks as though the programme might fold.

    Consider this photo from 1964 of the first involvement of Nigeria in the "space race" (taken from https://techpoint.africa/2022/01/27/nigerias-space-ambitions-pipe-dream/) It all looks very primitive to our Western eyes, yet a few decades later they were launching satellites:


    With similar imagery of poverty and primitive living we often see in adverts soliciting charitable donations to causes in African countries, it's easy for Western people to dismiss the fortitude of people in countries like Zambia where Edward Makuka Nkoloso was making huge strides towards lunar exploration as far back as 1964 while America and Russia vied for first place.  About a decade ago Captain Chris Nsamba was almost single-handedly building a space craft in Uganda.

    OK, so those last couple of links are kind of tongue in cheek and, I might add, poking a bit of fun at those people and their countries, however I think this is how an awful lot of people including me would have thought about India announcing plans to send a rocket to the moon a few decades ago.  I'm glad things have come so far along in the intervening years in some respects.
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  • OffsetOffset Frets: 9212
    Sporky said:
    Offset said:
    -sigh-

    No-one was suggesting 'that everything India as a nation does is in order to scam people' either.
    Someone did however suggest that that was why they'd gone to the moon.

    Do you think that was a racist suggestion?

    Bonus points for wriggling out of the question again. 
    I didn't 'wriggle' out of anything.  

    You said:
    It is racist to extrapolate that to suggest that all Indians are scammers or that everything India as a nation does is in order to scam people. Just as it is to suggest that India as a nation went to the moon to open a corner shop. 
    I said:  "Agreed, but nobody was suggesting that (until now)" 

    You then said "What about the rest of the sentence?"

    I responded.  You now appear to be asking me to respond to your next sentence which was "
    Just as it is (racist) to suggest that India as a nation went to the moon to open a corner shop."

    If you want an answer to your question, I suggest you ask it of the person who posted it.

    Why don't you address the massive disparity between rich and poor in India in the context of their moon landing, which was the main point I made in my original reply?  Isn't it contentious enough? 
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  • KilgoreKilgore Frets: 8107


    Might we maybe be a bit offended?  Despite the fact that globally, a lot of people see the British as fat, drunken vulgar or violent slobs obsessed with a dumb sport and historically mostly murderers, thieves and pirates? 





    Argh!

     Popular literature, TV and film, children's books and toys, etc, etc. We shouldn't feel ashamed about bringing 'pirates' to a global audience.  ;)
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  • SassafrasSassafras Frets: 30023
    Suella Braverman is looking into the feasibility of sending asylum seekers to the moon.
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  • SporkySporky Frets: 23802
    Offset said:

    Why don't you address the massive disparity between rich and poor in India in the context of their moon landing
    For exactly the same reason you won't address the racism question. 
    "[Sporky] brings a certain vibe and dignity to the forum."
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  • darthed1981darthed1981 Frets: 10322
    Kilgore said:


    Might we maybe be a bit offended?  Despite the fact that globally, a lot of people see the British as fat, drunken vulgar or violent slobs obsessed with a dumb sport and historically mostly murderers, thieves and pirates? 





    Argh!

     Popular literature, TV and film, children's books and toys, etc, etc. We shouldn't feel ashamed about bringing 'pirates' to a global audience.  ;)
    I know you are joking, but just in case anyone is ignorant of it...

    British wealth, particularly in the Tudor period, grew massively due to piracy, state-sponsored so officially "privateering" - mostly of Spanish ships around the Caribbean and returning from South America.  Sir Francis Drake, while yes he was a notable sailor, gained his fame, wealth and rank from piracy.

    The Spanish Armada was launched, largely, as a last gasp "please knock off all the piracy" gesture from the Spanish, who were losing noticeable wealth from their (unpleasant, murderous, genocidal) rule of their South American colonies.  Elizabeth I paid off all the national debt run up by her idiot father quite quickly, due to piracy.

    Even in the height of the British Empire in the 19th century, the Royal Navy had a generous and complex prize system to encourage ships to be taken, not sunk, to transfer that wealth to Britain.  Taking a treasure ship, rare as it was, would make the Captain a very rich man, and even the lowliest seaman could expect a massive payday.

    So yes, the British... conquerors, murderers, pillagers, pirates... occasional guardians of democracy and fair play, historically speaking.

    Probably worth commenting as well, that in the 18th-19th century, to not be conquering was to be conquered, and Britain was noticeably more decent and humane an occupier, by and large, than many other imperial powers. 

    However, I suspect the memory of Britain in India is not a fond one.  We may have built universities and railways, but we also were partly responsible for the unspeakable bloodshed of partition, not to mention the many, many atrocities committed over a century of direct rule.
    We have to be so very careful, what we believe in...
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