Why do all acoustics sound better with a capo?

guitarjack66 · June 2023

I have a jumbo i like playing now and again but its just a bit bulky and the scale just feels too long to a sitting player like me. The capo helps make it more playable and ergo more fun. How many classic songs were made using a capo? Glen Campbell loved them and who am I to disagree?

Kittyfrisk · June 2023

guitarjack66 said:

I have a jumbo i like playing now and again but its just a bit bulky and the scale just feels too long to a sitting player like me. The capo helps make it more playable and ergo more fun. How many classic songs were made using a capo? Glen Campbell loved them and who am I to disagree?

I think that was Eurythmics...

malcolmkindness · June 2023

DavidRees said:

ICBM said:

DavidRees said:

I find it odd when I see acoustic guitar instrumentalists using one on the first fret because surely it's just better to have the nut cut suitably to provide the action required

No, because it's not the same key, it's a semitone higher.

I find them very useful for changing the key of the song to fit a singer, or to use different inversions of chords when playing with another guitarist so it doesn't all sound too samey (or the opposite, I play without a capo when they're using one), and it does sound different - but not better or worse, and even if it was then the musical context is more important, so I wouldn't let the 'tone' dictate if I use one or not.

Hi ICBM, I understand the whole thing about adjusting the key to suit the vocal and use mine for that very purpose but still don't get why one would be used for instrumentals when surely the key doesn't really matter

Some jazz tunes sound better in flat keys, because that's how they were written. I sometimes (as a challenge to myself) play in E flat without a capo, but it's a struggle.

p90fool · June 2023

I use capos on acoustic guitars a lot when recording, usually on pretty high frets for a chiming mandolin type effect.

Far from "cheating", it becomes a different instrument.

digitalkettle · June 2023

malcolmkindness said:

DavidRees said:

ICBM said:

DavidRees said:

I find it odd when I see acoustic guitar instrumentalists using one on the first fret because surely it's just better to have the nut cut suitably to provide the action required

No, because it's not the same key, it's a semitone higher.

I find them very useful for changing the key of the song to fit a singer, or to use different inversions of chords when playing with another guitarist so it doesn't all sound too samey (or the opposite, I play without a capo when they're using one), and it does sound different - but not better or worse, and even if it was then the musical context is more important, so I wouldn't let the 'tone' dictate if I use one or not.

Hi ICBM, I understand the whole thing about adjusting the key to suit the vocal and use mine for that very purpose but still don't get why one would be used for instrumentals when surely the key doesn't really matter

Some jazz tunes sound better in flat keys, because that's how they were written. I sometimes (as a challenge to myself) play in E flat without a capo, but it's a struggle.

Here's a view from David Russell (a classical guitarist where capoing is pretty rare) talking about arranging Bach's 'Prelude, Fugue, and Allegro'...

Acoustic Guitar magazine said:

Bach wrote the prelude in Eb, so Russell tunes his low E string down to D and capos at the first fret. "We have so much repertoire in D major, it is refreshing to play in another key", says Russell, "The guitar also sounds lighter".

That's from a magazine I bought in 2004...it's not that significant but it always stuck in my mind for some reason.

bertie · June 2023

p90fool said:

I use capos on acoustic guitars a lot when recording, usually on pretty high frets for a chiming mandolin type effect.

Far from "cheating", it becomes a different instrument.

Hotel California is a great example. Capo the 7th

ICBM · June 2023

bertie said:

Hotel California is a great example. Capo the 7th

I learned Hotel California by ear without realising it was capo’d - it’s less obvious on a 12-string because they sound bright and jangly anyway - obviously with transposed chords, and now I can’t get my head around relearning it in the right position

.

guitarjack66 · June 2023

bertie said:

p90fool said:

I use capos on acoustic guitars a lot when recording, usually on pretty high frets for a chiming mandolin type effect.

Far from "cheating", it becomes a different instrument.

Hotel California is a great example. Capo the 7th

'Girl' by the Beatles is often capoed at the 8th fret and is a great little tune.

idiotwind · June 2023

DavidRees said:

Hi ICBM, I understand the whole thing about adjusting the key to suit the vocal and use mine for that very purpose but still don't get why one would be used for instrumentals when surely the key doesn't really matter

Sometimes the capo can be part of the performance - I had an audio copy of this for years before I found a video and realised he was shifting the capo up and down

bertie · June 2023

ICBM said:

bertie said:

Hotel California is a great example. Capo the 7th

I learned Hotel California by ear without realising it was capo’d - it’s less obvious on a 12-string because they sound bright and jangly anyway - obviously with transposed chords, and now I can’t get my head around relearning it in the right position .

I kind of found out by accident from a video of a guy playing it at the 7th. starting Em and a little "inset" of him playing the normal "open" starting in Bm

It was a "light bulb" moment as to why the "fiddly picky" and hammer on type bits just didnt work using the "normal" chords !!!

I even did a little recording of it myself - but its everso slightly out of sync

Yorkie · June 2023

A capo can also become a pathetic singer’s best friend. I’ve got one upstairs and another one downstairs.

Tannin · June 2023

Yorkie said:

A capo can also become a pathetic singer’s best friend. I’ve got one upstairs and another one downstairs.

You need two?

Oh, I get it. One on your throat and the other one down on your balls to help with the high notes.

Open_G · June 2023

I played in an acoustic duo for a time where the vast majority of songs seemed to need to be shifted up for the singers natural range. I ended up teasing her with the name 4th fret Fanny. It certainly made harmonies a challenge but it would have made for some funky chords without the capo. I kind of liked the way it made certain songs feel very different played there. Prime example was out acoustic version of mr brightside.

Yorkie · June 2023

Open_G said:

I played in an acoustic duo for a time where the vast majority of songs seemed to need to be shifted up for the singers natural range. I ended up teasing her with the name 4th fret Fanny. It certainly made harmonies a challenge but it would have made for some funky chords without the capo. I kind of liked the way it made certain songs feel very different played there. Prime example was out acoustic version of mr brightside.

That’s the thing, why work hard when the capo can make your life easier?

guitarjack66 · June 2023

Yorkie said:

Open_G said:

I played in an acoustic duo for a time where the vast majority of songs seemed to need to be shifted up for the singers natural range. I ended up teasing her with the name 4th fret Fanny. It certainly made harmonies a challenge but it would have made for some funky chords without the capo. I kind of liked the way it made certain songs feel very different played there. Prime example was out acoustic version of mr brightside.

That’s the thing, why work hard when the capo can make your life easier?

Yeah. I suppose that in Golf you aren't required to use a tee to play from the teeing area nor in Snooker would you need a rest or spider if you could contort your cueing arm into different positions,but using them makes a very difficult pastime a touch easier than it otherwise is. I guess a capo is the musical equivalent? Take all the help you can.

ICBM · June 2023

Open_G said:

I played in an acoustic duo for a time where the vast majority of songs seemed to need to be shifted up for the singers natural range. I ended up teasing her with the name 4th fret Fanny. It certainly made harmonies a challenge but it would have made for some funky chords without the capo.

When I played electric in a band with an acoustic player who did the same, I purposely played most of the songs *without* the capo, so I had to use barre shapes most of the time. It sounded much better than having the two guitars playing in the same positions, even if I wasn’t duplicating her parts. I still used the capo occasionally, but usually in a lower position so I could use open chords that still sounded different.

ESBlonde · June 2023

Yorkie said:

A capo can also become a pathetic singer’s best friend. I’ve got one upstairs and another one downstairs.

Why would you keep two pathetic singers?

drofluf · June 2023

ESBlonde said:

Yorkie said:

A capo can also become a pathetic singer’s best friend. I’ve got one upstairs and another one downstairs.

Why would you keep two pathetic singers?

Well they’re cheap so if it’s more convenient…

Yorkie · June 2023

I am the pathetic singer. Not sure that was clear from my message.

bertie · June 2023

Yorkie said:

I am the pathetic singer.

the less successful predecessor to "masked singer"

Mellish · June 2023

I use a capo.

If I'm gigging, say, and getting ready to do Dirty Old Town, I'll do that open on banjo in D (5th string capo'd up). If I'm doing Eve of Destruction, that's on guitar cap'd up 2nd fret and play in G (well A really) so I get that nice 6th string thud.

maltingsaudio · June 2023

Some songs only work round one chord shape eg Romeo and Juliet try playing that picking pattern in using F barre!

Personally hate capos but are a necessary evil.

Going back to the original point my Fylde sounds worse with a capo to my ears , but then it also has a Zero Fret ………

bertie · June 2023

I own 6, correction 7

Mellish · June 2023

I have 6. One I haven't seen for months but it's here somewhere.

guitarjack66 · June 2023

ICBM said:

Open_G said:

I played in an acoustic duo for a time where the vast majority of songs seemed to need to be shifted up for the singers natural range. I ended up teasing her with the name 4th fret Fanny. It certainly made harmonies a challenge but it would have made for some funky chords without the capo.

When I played electric in a band with an acoustic player who did the same, I purposely played most of the songs *without* the capo, so I had to use barre shapes most of the time. It sounded much better than having the two guitars playing in the same positions, even if I wasn’t duplicating her parts. I still used the capo occasionally, but usually in a lower position so I could use open chords that still sounded different.

I find barres a heck of a lot easier on electrics. I am guessing this is why a fair few players begin with electrics rather than acoustics? It does seem more practical if you are a youngster or have some restrictions physically. I started on acoustic because I felt that if I could get to grips with an acoustic then I could play any conventional guitar. In hindsight I think I was correct but I can see why many impatient youngsters and people in general would not. I think a capo is a good way of bridging that 'an acoustic is too hard' gap.

ICBM · June 2023

guitarjack66 said:

I find barres a heck of a lot easier on electrics. I am guessing this is why a fair few players begin with electrics rather than acoustics? It does seem more practical if you are a youngster or have some restrictions physically. I started on acoustic because I felt that if I could get to grips with an acoustic then I could play any conventional guitar. In hindsight I think I was correct but I can see why many impatient youngsters and people in general would not. I think a capo is a good way of bridging that 'an acoustic is too hard' gap.

Agreed. Although I did make things intentionally hard for myself by forcing myself to learn to play barre chords properly on a 12-string! It was torture at first, but worth it - I can now easily play barres all the way through a song on either acoustic or electric if I want to. Usually I don’t now since I don’t play guitar in that sort of band any more, but the option is there if necessary.

Getting your acoustic set up properly makes a huge difference too - it doesn’t have to be as low as an electric to make a big difference compared to most acoustic factory set-ups. Not using unnecessarily heavy strings also helps…

bertie · June 2023

ICBM said:

guitarjack66 said:

I find barres a heck of a lot easier on electrics. I am guessing this is why a fair few players begin with electrics rather than acoustics? It does seem more practical if you are a youngster or have some restrictions physically. I started on acoustic because I felt that if I could get to grips with an acoustic then I could play any conventional guitar. In hindsight I think I was correct but I can see why many impatient youngsters and people in general would not. I think a capo is a good way of bridging that 'an acoustic is too hard' gap.

Agreed.

I struggle with "E" barre chords even on electrics, my index finger just doesn't "work" right, never had - so I 99% of the time use a thumb over "F" barre, which makes playing status quo stuff "challenging"

guitarjack66 · June 2023

bertie said:

ICBM said:

guitarjack66 said:

I find barres a heck of a lot easier on electrics. I am guessing this is why a fair few players begin with electrics rather than acoustics? It does seem more practical if you are a youngster or have some restrictions physically. I started on acoustic because I felt that if I could get to grips with an acoustic then I could play any conventional guitar. In hindsight I think I was correct but I can see why many impatient youngsters and people in general would not. I think a capo is a good way of bridging that 'an acoustic is too hard' gap.

Agreed.

I struggle with "E" barre chords even on electrics, my index finger just doesn't "work" right, never had - so I 99% of the time use a thumb over "F" barre, which makes playing status quo stuff "challenging"

That's interesting as I find the E shape the easiest of the lot. I only bother with E and A shapes and play the D shapes open. The C shape barre is pretty much impossible for me,although I understand the theory behind CAGED.

marxski · June 2023

bertie said:

Yorkie said:

I am the pathetic singer.

the less successful predecessor to "masked singer"

I think you should sell this idea to the TV networks Bertie.

crunchman · June 2023

bertie said:

ICBM said:

guitarjack66 said:

I find barres a heck of a lot easier on electrics. I am guessing this is why a fair few players begin with electrics rather than acoustics? It does seem more practical if you are a youngster or have some restrictions physically. I started on acoustic because I felt that if I could get to grips with an acoustic then I could play any conventional guitar. In hindsight I think I was correct but I can see why many impatient youngsters and people in general would not. I think a capo is a good way of bridging that 'an acoustic is too hard' gap.

Agreed.

I struggle with "E" barre chords even on electrics, my index finger just doesn't "work" right, never had - so I 99% of the time use a thumb over "F" barre, which makes playing status quo stuff "challenging"

My fingers are too short to do the thumb over thing. It's really frustrating at times. I'd love to be able to put an F# bass in a D chord.

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Why do all acoustics sound better with a capo?

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