Can Ed Sheeran really play?

roberty · February 2023

Creed_Clicks said:

"Does it stand the test of time" is a bit subjective though.

I don't think people give old music the credit it deserves for being mostly fucking atrocious

stickyfiddle · February 2023

guitarjack66 said:

Kilgore said:

As I said,let's wait 20 years and see if he still has the appeal. He will certainly be a better player whatever. The term 'best' or 'legendary' is bandied around far too readily in all walks of life yet is only deserving of the elite. Sheeran is not that after only a decade.

It's funny because I could make the same argument about Page and Clapton. The best bits of their entire careers were only 10 years or so each. And it's been pretty consistently downhill since.

And Sheeran's certainly written more popular songs than Clapton managed

impmann · February 2023

Of course "he can play". Music isn't a competition or spectator *sport*. And as @ICBM points out he's done huge shows just him, an acoustic and a looper - and in so doing shown he is accomplished at doing just that.

Snags · February 2023

It all hinges on what you mean by "best", which covers a multitude of sins and is in almost all cases highly subjective anyway - technique, speed, melody, capturing the popular imagination, songwriting, selling tickets, being really rude to the audience because you're a stroppy alcoholic etc. etc.

When some popular makes a best list that also includes virtuosos who are considerably less commercial, there's often a lot of sniffing about it, but that's just because of your assumed criteria on "best". And frankly, I'd rather listen to a bunch of Ed Sheeran than a lot of the virtuoso stuff. And I don't particularly like Ed Sheeran.

Kilgore · February 2023

guitarjack66 said:

Kilgore said:

Sheeran is a talented musician but no, he is not a virtuoso guitar player.

Comparisons to Tommy E are utterly pointless. It's apples and oranges. Emmanuel is virtuoso player and raconteur but appeals to a 'niche' market. Sheeran is globally successful pop artist. Never the twain shall meet.

In terms of longevity, Sheeran has been successful for over a decade and his popularity shows no sign of abating, which is decent run by anyone's standards.

He has probably played to more people on a single tour than Tommy E has during his entire career.

As I said,let's wait 20 years and see if he still has the appeal. He will certainly be a better player whatever. The term 'best' or 'legendary' is bandied around far too readily in all walks of life yet is only deserving of the elite. Sheeran is not that after only a decade.

I just said Sheeran was very, very popular and has been for the best part of a decade. I didn't make any comment about 'best'

guitarjack66 · February 2023

stickyfiddle said:

guitarjack66 said:

Kilgore said:

As I said,let's wait 20 years and see if he still has the appeal. He will certainly be a better player whatever. The term 'best' or 'legendary' is bandied around far too readily in all walks of life yet is only deserving of the elite. Sheeran is not that after only a decade.

It's funny because I could make the same argument about Page and Clapton. The best bits of their entire careers were only 10 years or so each. And it's been pretty consistently downhill since.

And Sheeran's certainly written more popular songs than Clapton managed

As much as I am not fan on Clapton I have heard some of the songs he's played on or sang and they have mass appeal and recognition across a large demographic. If Sheeran can do that in the future then he will be mentioned among the very elite. Not yet though. I also haven't said he's bad,I imagine,just not at the elite level of some previously mentioned as that takes time. Are you Ed Sheeran as you seem to be taking a random person on the internet's opinion very seriously?

sev112 · February 2023

Brilliant rhythm guitar playing

Sporky · February 2023

We should do a list of the best lists.

merlin · February 2023

stickyfiddle said:

And Sheeran's certainly written more popular songs than Clapton managed

True. And annually, Mills & Boon sell more books than copies of Shakespeare.

Popularity and quality are different things, and it's not a good idea to measure them in the same way.

Gandalph · February 2023

Entertaining thread.

Which is ironic as it is about someone who, for me at least, is the antithesis of entertainment.

Cant deny his mass popularity though. Again a turn off in itself.

digitalkettle · February 2023

stickyfiddle said:

He's great - he has absolute mastery of looping within songs that millions of people want to listen to, and does it on his own in front of 40,000 people.

@stickyfiddle ;;Even more impressively, I've seen him hold it together when it started to come apart in a stadium...seat of his pants stuff...balls of steel.

It's not really my bag but I do wish that he'd push the songwriting a bit further than a four chord classic...he just couldn't compete in that Yesterday film*

* dude doesn't take himself too seriously either which is endearing

Pjon · February 2023

merlin said:

stickyfiddle said:

And Sheeran's certainly written more popular songs than Clapton managed

True. And annually, Mills & Boon sell more books than copies of Shakespeare.

Popularity and quality are different things, and it's not a good idea to measure them in the same way.

But, in terms of 'will their music last', they'll probably go the same way. I doubt that any of my teen daughters recognise any Clapton songs. Even my wife, aged early 40s, would maybe spot one or two but not know that he sang them. (Just remembered - she loves 'Tears in Heaven'.) Clapton, great guitarist or not, is disappearing into obscurity. Go and ask the kids.

bertie · February 2023

merlin said:

Popularity and quality are different things,

as we were once told in a corporate improvement program

Quality is conformance to requirements

Lestratcaster · February 2023

Depends what your interpretation of "play" means. As a solo artist who writes their own music, performs, and makes money then yes he can do it. He does use interesting tunings and looping etc.

But as a technical player with all the advanced techniques then no.

LastMantra · February 2023

Of course he can play!

He chooses not to do all the widdley wang stuff, not his style, but yes, he's a great guitar player.

I've never even listened to him and I can tell you that.

How many times do you here people on here say things like "play for the song", "keep it simple", "timing is more important than..." etc. etc.

LastMantra · February 2023

I'd rather listen to Kurt cobain personally, but obviously they are/were great guitar playing musicians.

If you can express yourself to a satisfactory level and people want to listen then you can't exactly be a bad player.

LastMantra · February 2023

Wilko Johnson?

randella · February 2023

Pjon said:

merlin said:

stickyfiddle said:

And Sheeran's certainly written more popular songs than Clapton managed

True. And annually, Mills & Boon sell more books than copies of Shakespeare.

Popularity and quality are different things, and it's not a good idea to measure them in the same way.

But, in terms of 'will their music last', they'll probably go the same way. I doubt that any of my teen daughters recognise any Clapton songs. Even my wife, aged early 40s, would maybe spot one or two but not know that he sang them. (Just remembered - she loves 'Tears in Heaven'.) Clapton, great guitarist or not, is disappearing into obscurity. Go and ask the kids.

Probably also worth bearing in mind that Sheeran's been at the top of his game selling out mega-barns in an era where the number of artists releasing new music is stratospheric. How many tunes uploaded to Spotify every day? Tens of thousands?

A friend uploaded a screenshot of the top 20 from decades ago to Facebook recently - apart from a tune by the Jam, and an honorable mention for Last Night a DJ Saved My Life, the rest of it was honestly pish. This in a time when the most popular music was collated in very few places.

darthed1981 · February 2023

ditchboy said:

Not in my opinion. But he can write catchy song after catchy song which ultimately is the more difficult skill.

So happy to see this as the first post.

There is a really interesting tendency whenever a thread discusses a major artist on here for everyone to say "yeah, but XX is shit compared to person YY who nobody has ever heard of..." ... I think it's fairly safe to say absolute technical skill as a contest would make very little interesting music... isn't this art not sport?

The discipline and work needed to become a virtuoso musician is of course worthy of respect, but if this was the only criteria we judged music on, we would all have written off the Beatles and gone to watch any reasonable orchestra instead! There are thousands of virtuoso musicians in the world, they barely cross over with the most popular.

People absolutely love Ed Sheeran. In a world where music itself as a pastime is struggling to keep pace with tik tok and you tube and many other social media thingies, not to mention the colossal juggernaut of gaming, and you have a guy who can fill Wembley standing on stage with a guitar and a loop pedal.

As musicians, as a whole, we should probably be grateful to Ed for keeping us relevant.

Still interesting.

darthed1981 · February 2023

merlin said:

stickyfiddle said:

And Sheeran's certainly written more popular songs than Clapton managed

True. And annually, Mills & Boon sell more books than copies of Shakespeare.

Popularity and quality are different things, and it's not a good idea to measure them in the same way.

Interesting analogy as of course Shakespeare was the mass entertainment of his day, and most of what he did was for the mass-consumption of the people. He just happens to be considered a master of the English language now, 400 years later.

A better analogy would be something like the Harry Potter books. The current backlash against JK Rowling notwithstanding, they are probably more likely a "Shakespeare of our day" than Mills and Boon?

Mozart wrote popular entertainments as well of course.

Are you trying to say that very popular entertainments of now are less well-equipped to stand the test of time?

A really interesting thought, for me, is of course that it's entirely possible that NOTHING in the pop/rock era will still be listened to in 400 years time. It's mostly about recordings, which are stored almost entirely digitally at this point and easily lost, and the scores carry across nothing, a future musicologist is in reality as likely to write variations on a theme of Ed Sheeran's as he is the Beatles...

RocknRollDave · February 2023

Musicians can be a tiresomely snobbish bunch.

GTC · February 2023

Tannin said:

GTC said:

To be frank, I'm more surprised that James Taylor is on the list.

James Taylor is a top drawer guitarist in anybody's language. Yes, he made his name in the 1960s and 70s as a maudlin but popular singer-songwriter, and he was good at that, sure. He sold a ton of records. But in the many years since then he has honed his instrumental skills and these days is better known as an acoustic guitarist of virtuoso grade. Absolutely no surprise to see him on that, or any other list.

Fair enough - I must admit my memories of him are from the "Fire and Rain" days. I guess I need to some catching up when I've got time.

BTW - Pete Atkin and Clive James did a great send-up of JT in his maudlin days with the number "Identity Crisis Rock" on their "Live Rebel" album

AlexO · February 2023

He's the songwriter who normally would work for a big label behind the scenes but somehow he's become a superstar.
Not my thing but of course he can play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEPXpYWlnpc
Did think he would take solo here though.

roberty · February 2023

RocknRollDave said:

Musicians can be a tiresomely snobbish bunch.

I know plenty of non musicians who would rather drown than listen to ed sheeran

roberty · February 2023

Scientists confirm we are all living in Ed Sheeran's dream

OUR reality is just a dream in the mind of sleeping Ed Sheeran, it has been confirmed.

Researchers at the Institute for Studies found it was impossible Sheeran could be the world’s most famous male pop star unless he has direct control over our universe.

Professor Henry Brubaker said: “Ed Sheeran looks like he works part-time in an organic farm shop. There’s no way he’s a pop star. No way.

“The only explanation is the we live in a ‘Sheeran Universe’. The real Ed Sheeran, who works three days a week stacking crates of parsnips and plays Nick Drake covers in his local pub twice a month, is asleep and dreaming of pop stardom.

“In this dream he’s incredibly rich and gets to shag loads of models even though they are three feet taller than him. You and I are just supporting characters and if real Ed Sheeran ever wakes up we will cease to exist.”

He added: “Possibly real Ed Sheeran lives in the same universe where Adele works in an Asda warehouse putting cellophane on trays of fish.”

Teacher Mary Fisher said: “At first I was sceptical, but then I got on a bus that had a picture of Ed Sheeran on it, opened the Metro at an article about Ed Sheeran then stared out of the window at a billboard of Ed Sheeran’s massive face.”

https://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/science-technology/scientists-confirm-we-are-all-living-in-ed-sheerans-dream-20170328124943

RocknRollDave · February 2023

roberty said:

RocknRollDave said:

Musicians can be a tiresomely snobbish bunch.

I know plenty of non musicians who would rather drown than listen to ed sheeran

I don’t want to listen to him either, but that doesn’t mean he isn’t talented. Some people seem to equate ‘I don’t like’ with ‘this person is talentless’.

darthed1981 · February 2023

roberty said:

RocknRollDave said:

Musicians can be a tiresomely snobbish bunch.

I know plenty of non musicians who would rather drown than listen to ed sheeran

I'm for some reason mentally picturing someone mortally terrified as their lungs fill with water re-thinking whether a quick play-through of "bad habits" really was the worse option...

roberty · February 2023

RocknRollDave said:

roberty said:

RocknRollDave said:

Musicians can be a tiresomely snobbish bunch.

I know plenty of non musicians who would rather drown than listen to ed sheeran

I don’t want to listen to him either, but that doesn’t mean he isn’t talented. Some people seem to equate ‘I don’t like’ with ‘this person is talentless’.

Ah okay I must have missed those posts

Someone's got to top the charts and he has done so consistently so fair play. Definitely defit not my thing though

bertie said:

merlin said:

Popularity and quality are different things,

as we were once told in a corporate improvement program

Quality is conformance to requirements

This is perfect. I think Sheeran might even have a song called Perfect too

darthed1981 · February 2023

roberty said:

This is perfect. I think Sheeran might even have a song called Perfect too

The Lightning Seeds did...

bertie · February 2023

darthed1981 said:

roberty said:

This is perfect. I think Sheeran might even have a song called Perfect too

The Lightning Seeds did...

wasnt it Fairground Attraction ? (or possibly both............no idea about the Seeds TBH)

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Can Ed Sheeran really play?

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Scientists confirm we are all living in Ed Sheeran's dream