The Too Valuable To Play Syndrome

RocknRollDave · August 2013

Assuming money was no obstacle (which it most certainly is!), I genuinely wouldn't want to own an expensive, vintage guitar.

I would genuinely be happier with a brand new guitar off the shelf with no dings or marks or scratches, and which would cost me a fraction of the price.

EDIT: I have never played a 50's LP or Strat or 335 or whatever...If I were to buy a vintage guitar, I'd be doing so purely because the accepted wisdom tends to be that they are better...I'd rather pick up a few new guitars and try them out and pick the one i like best, rather than invest too much belief in the idea that somewhere out there is a magical, vintage guitar imbued with a special, personal mojo that is calling out for me and no other guitar will do.

ESBlonde · August 2013

Way back in the 70s and 80s I would be paranoid about taking my gigging guitar to some venues because I couldn't afford to replace it. Now I have a few more guitars I take them all out gigging but there are undoubtedly some venues I would not take certain instruments like then 335 which still hasn't had a big ding or headstock detachment operation! I'm more likely to turn down the shyte gig than risk a guitar I'm attached to.

If I had a very expensive guitar I would gig it but I would be very selective about where and when.

jaygtr · August 2013

A guitar doesn't necessarily have to be worth much in monetary terms , to be incredibly valuable to a person.
They can have huge sentimental value and therefore be irreplaceable .

My les Paul is nothing special, but I brought it new and have owned it almost half my life , I don't mind a few dings etc, but I'm am increasingly careful with it B-)

Longtallronnie · August 2013

I gig my Fat Neck 335 reguarly with an SG Classic as backup which is close to £4k's worth in total by new prices. The 335 is priceless to me and I do sometimes worry about it getting nicked or damaged. That's why I insure them though, £17 a month covers all of my giging gear so I get some piece of mind.

The small amount of worry is completely offset by the sheer joy I get from playing them though.

I'd love to own a vintage Gibson, preferably a "players" guitar with some character to it and I'd happily gig it.

Skipped · August 2013

DLM said:

For just one instrument, I'd say Skipped and his LP.

I appreciate the mention!
But player grade vintage guitars are not that expensive. I think there is a forum member (In fact there might be a few) who owns an aged and signed Beano or similar which I am pretty sure would have cost more than my guitar. Most Conversions change hands through word of mouth or on the LPF. The Conversions with dealers at $35k are not moving - the sellers are dreaming - and probably never will.
Guitars with changes, or refins (or both) are amazing for players because they are are just about within reach, you can gig them even if you don't employ security, but most important of all, they can play and sound exactly the same as the guitars that collectors have locked away.
But If anybody wins the lottery I would suggest you would want both!

TTony · August 2013

jatgtr said:

A guitar doesn't necessarily have to be worth much in monetary terms , to be incredibly valuable to a person.
They can have huge sentimental value and therefore be irreplaceable .

And your first fret award shall be a wisdom fret

monquixote · August 2013

I've gigged all my guitars including my Gretsch (which is the only one worth more than a grand SH), but the one I'm weary of taking to gigs is my 1980 "The Strat" it's beaten to fuck, heavily modded, and probably worth nothing, but it's the only inanimate object in the world I have any emotional attachment to.

bertie · August 2013

I dont see the problem, if someone wants to spend inordinate amounts of cash on guitars just to look at, and it gives them pleasure - who the fuck do we think we are to criticise that ?

[Deleted User] · August 2013

bertie;7698" said:
I dont see the problem, if someone wants to spend inordinate amounts of cash on guitars just to look at, and it gives them pleasure - who the fuck do we think we are to criticise that ?

I agree. I'd much prefer that Joe Bonamassa just looked at his....

DulcetJones · August 2013

I came into ownership of a mint 1967 Fender Mustang guitar back in the 80's through a fluke situation. I loved it, used it at gigs for a about a year until Nirvana hit the scene. My guitar was the right hand equivalent of Cobains Mustang and a local music store employee approached me wanting to buy it. I had it appraised and was a little horrified at how much it was worth. I stopped using it and kept if hidden way for over a decade, then I put it out on a stand in my living room so I could pick it up and play it around the house. Then my house got broken into and it was stolen, I had it insured for an amount that turned out to be about a third of what it was worth. As it turned out the thief was a moron and pawned it the day he stole it and I got it back the same day. He got 3 months and I sold the guitar for a ridiculous amount and cancelled the insurance. I was told by the guitar broker that the new owner is very happy with the guitar.

Trotter · August 2013

Same as a lot of comments here really: I have one particular guitar that only comes out at the bigger shows and precisely for this reason I'm currently thinking of selling to replace it with 2/3 less valuable guitars that I won't be worried to gig. Wierdly however I have one other guitar which is worth more than the case queen in question that comes to every show; the difference is to the untrained eye the "battered old guitar" is worth considerably less than the "fancy flamey one" that's in mint condition. We are a strange bunch aren't we!?!?

ChrisMusic · August 2013

Trotter said:

... the difference is to the untrained eye the "battered old guitar" is worth considerably less than the "fancy flamey one" that's in mint condition. We are a strange bunch aren't we!?!?

It's all a matter of risk management.

Making it difficult for them is always a discouragement, and hopefully they will leave well alone, no thief wants to get nicked. (Unless they are drug fuelled, and then there is no common sense or predictability and anything goes.)

As a photographer I am well aware that recognisable "name" brands, and new looking nice shiny things that will be easy to sell on to the unscrupulous, are sought after targets. Kids in third world countries are taught to look out for "Nikon" or "Canon". One protection is to travel with battered old kit, or lesser known brands. Another is to cover cases with rough old stickers. On the camera, insulation tape over the brand name, and probably bits over the body so it looks old scruffy and unloved (read - not worth nicking, as who would want that old thing)

I shudder at the thought of a 59 LP covered in gaffer tape though.

So I'm not sure these ideas translate to music kit that easily.

And wasn't there just a bit of ego in what you were playing, or was I just so much younger then?

stickyfiddle · August 2013

I don't take my CS336 to potentially dive-y venues, or anywhere that might be a small stage, easy steal, etc. I bought my broke-necked SG precisely so I could have a take-anywhere, throw-around Gibson.

But I wouldn't go so far as to not play a guitar for fear of ruining its value. I'd never buy a vintage gutiar so mint that making repairs (changing scratchy pots, etc) would kill its value. That's a fools' game.

mike_l · August 2013

The only guitar I'd be really wary of taking any where dodgy would be my Jackson as, to me, it's irreplaceable.

[Deleted User] · August 2013

Further to my earlier comments about Joe Bonamassa gigging vintage Gibsons; I was with someone last night who has worked with him quite extensively. He tells me JB now owns '6 or 7' LPs made between '58 & '60.... The guy's clearly doing well...

redrighthand · August 2013

I'm a bit like this. Bought a LP a while back that I've never taken out of the house. Now I have a couple of MJT relics I feel even less inclined to do so. Hence it's - as of yesterday - in the classifieds.

The first ding is the deepest though, always.

scrumhalf · August 2013

What makes a guitar valuable? The price that someone (other than the current owner) will pay for it.I don't believe that sentiment plays any part in it.

It's for the owner to decide whether it remains an instrument to be played or an investment to be protected.

I'm sure there must be similar arguments goiong on in classic car forums/fora across the web.

ICBM · August 2013

scrumhalf said:

What makes a guitar valuable? The price that someone (other than the current owner) will pay for it.I don't believe that sentiment plays any part in it.

Not entirely true. I have a guitar (not the Rick) which is very valuable to me, although probably not to anyone else - to the point I'd be careful about taking it out to gigs. It's a twin of the first electric guitar I owned in 1985, which I then proceeded to modify to destruction. It turned out to be a very rare model - it took me fifteen years and a worldwide search to find another one, and cost me at least twice what I would expect the market value in this country to be.

tonyrath · August 2013

To me several strands emerge

1 The collector who either through desire or investment buys vintage or valuable guitars but does not play

2 The semi pro or pro player who has a valuable instrument which only comes out when it is safe to do so

3 The rich hobbyist who buys a top name guitar and derive enjoyment from doing so

4 The pro or semi pro who pays a good price for an instrument which is well used.

None of these to me are wrong choices BUT the collector who does not know how to look after their instruments, thats a different matter

[Deleted User] · August 2013

tonyrath;8883" said:
To me several strands emerge

1 The collector who either through desire or investment buys vintage or valuable guitars but does not play

2 The semi pro or pro player who has a valuable instrument which only comes out when it is safe to do so

3 The rich hobbyist who buys a top name guitar and derive enjoyment from doing so

4 The pro or semi pro who pays a good price for an instrument which is well used.

None of these to me are wrong choices BUT the collector who does not know how to look after their instruments, thats a different matter

Or the relatively impoverished player who saves hard to buy the instrument of their dreams as they are massively dedicated to their art and want the best tool available?

stonevibe · August 2013

I generally prefer buying used, player grade guitars anyway. They just feel nicely worn in and you don't get the 'first ding' issue as someone has done that for you already.

Whenever I look for a new guitar (currently on the lookout for a Japanese Custom Tele '72...), I look for used examples first and preferably ones with dings. Mainly because then it will also be cheaper!

tonyrath · August 2013

FAO Richard yep that will do it too although I think that is covered to a certain extent by my point 4

randomhandclaps · August 2013

To buy a guitar and decide it's too precious to play is a bit like marrying a model and then deciding she's too beautiful to shag.

impmann · August 2013

Having had a vintage guitar (1968 Telecaster) stolen from the stage in a small pub in North London, I can tell you it hurts. A lot.

But, you know they are only pieces of wood with some magnets and a few bits of metal... and although I lost every penny I didn't have in the world, I got over it and kept playing. I've since replaced the guitar and you know, the replacement is probably better!

grungebob · August 2013

I realised after my 3rd prs that I don't like being the one who damages the guitar first,so got scared of playing them,now all my guitars are either used or in the case of the jaguar a relic so I don't worry about these things and can just enjoy them.

digitalkettle · August 2013

impmann said:

Having had a vintage guitar (1968 Telecaster) stolen from the stage in a small pub in North London, I can tell you it hurts. A lot.

But, you know they are only pieces of wood with some magnets and a few bits of metal... and although I lost every penny I didn't have in the world, I got over it and kept playing. I've since replaced the guitar and you know, the replacement is probably better!

Bad times...how did that happen? Were you distracted or was it opportunistic?

ICBM · August 2013

grungebob said:

I realised after my 3rd prs that I don't like being the one who damages the guitar first,so got scared of playing them,now all my guitars are either used or in the case of the jaguar a relic so I don't worry about these things and can just enjoy them.

I bought all my PRSs pre-dinged... even the new one. Nice big shop dent which saved me £700 off the list price, I asked if they could do another one and take another £700 off but they said no

.

That said, there's just something 'PRS' about them which makes them more of a worry at gigs than a beaten-up old Fender which is actually worth more - or even a more fragile Gibson... I don't know what/why exactly.

impmann · August 2013

digitalkettle said:

impmann said:

Having had a vintage guitar (1968 Telecaster) stolen from the stage in a small pub in North London, I can tell you it hurts. A lot.

But, you know they are only pieces of wood with some magnets and a few bits of metal... and although I lost every penny I didn't have in the world, I got over it and kept playing. I've since replaced the guitar and you know, the replacement is probably better!

Bad times...how did that happen? Were you distracted or was it opportunistic?

We'd finished the gig and I'd left the guitar on a stand on the 'stage'. I went to the bar to get a drink. Out of the corner of my eye I saw something move and realised that it was my guitar being carried out the pub by another guy. I gave chase up the road shouting every name I could think of - and then rounded a corner to find him standing there with a group of his mates... and all of them were a lot bigger and scarier than me. It was clear that if I tried to get it back off them, I would end up seriously hurt, so I admitted defeat and walked back to the pub - crying.

Its not nice, I can tell you.

digitalkettle · August 2013

Damn, that's harsh...you might have stood a chance if you'd been swinging a backup Tele

jaygtr · August 2013

What a horrible story. You did the right thing though

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The Too Valuable To Play Syndrome

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