Calling Audiophiles. Turntable recommendation and setup

Octavio · September 2023

I read similar posts on here from 2021, but wanted see if people’s opinions have changed. Recently I inherited some vinyl but alas, I have nothing to play it on. I’ve been researching the subject online and really am none the wiser. There’s the crowd that proclaim that all modern turntables are crap and made in the same Chinese factory (second part could well be true), with the golden age for turntables being 1970-1980. Needless to say, I also have no preamp.

Should I be going for something modern like the Audio Technical AT-LP120xBTUSB with Bluetooth being a nice feature, or should I be looking at something more vintage like the Thorens TD-160? If the latter, what would be the preamp recommendation?

My setup is, I have a pair of Genelec 8020Ds which I run my Quad Cortex into. In an ideal world I wouldn’t have to keep swapping out cables to listen to a record. Budget is circa £200-500. I don’t mind spending a bit more if it means a one time purchase.

theatreanchor · September 2023

Get the SL1500C.

stickyfiddle · September 2023

I got a Concept MM turntable and Cambridge AXR100 last year and they’re
fabulous. I have very little to add outside that, but I’m happy.

viz · September 2023

It’s a never-ending quest, or can be. I’d get something upgradeable personally, because breathing new life into your system is fun and awakens all your records again. All the main famous turntables are good.

mudslide73 · September 2023

Some form of Rega P3.

viz · September 2023

^ yup, spot on.

Octavio · September 2023

Sounds like the general advice is stay away from the old stuff. Maybe I just go for simplicity and run a modern turntable with a built it preamp RDA > XLR to the Genelec monitors.

TheMarlin · September 2023

I’ve got four turntables at the moment.

My home made Rega geometry based system (no Rega parts) with Michelle Technoarm 2 and Nagaoka MP500.
A Nottingham Audio Hyperspace with heavy kit, and Origin Live Conqueror tone srm, with Koetsu Black cartridge
Heavily modded Lenco GL75 with Saturn arm, heavy custom plinth

Systemdek 1 with a Project 9cc Carbon arm. Fully restored with new paint job, and rebuilt upgraded power supply.

They’re all lovely, but I the system deck is only worth about £300 (without the arm), and it’s beautifully engineered, and kicks the ass out of anything Rega at that price point. Later system decks were re-engineered to make manufacturing cheaper, they’re no where near as good as the original model. I’m very impressed with it, using it with a Ortofon 520 MK2, sound glorious.

I may possibly be donating it to a friend, but might also consider a guitar trade for it

They all sound great, but the Nottingham Audio deck is pretty immense. I have a fight on my hands. I’ve had the living room rebuilt and decorated, and Hifi system is a feature in the corner. Wife loves the Lenco. Loads of wood, matches all the oak, nice flash of red, and it’s pretty.

I favour the architectural Nottingham Audio deck, big, black, impressive looking, sounds as good as it looks.

I might put all four up for sale/trade, and keep the two that don’t sell.

TheMarlin · September 2023

If you want good cheap, looks for a lightly used Nad 533. Can be found for £100 ish used, and is a fab modding platform to bring it to greatness.

Lots of great kids on the used market, so not tooo expense to elevate performance.

It’s a Rega P2 in Nad clothing. Comes with a RV250 arm, which is decent, easy and cheap to modify to vastly improve performance.

sweepy · September 2023

Old stuff is where the good sounding bargains reside

Rocker · September 2023

Why not visit a real hi-fi dealer and listen to suggested combinations there. It is your ears that are going to listen to your system so you decide what you like. I have my ideas about the sound I like, those ideas might not suit you. If you want a three piece suit of clothes, you go to a tailor or a specialist clothing shop. It is no different when it is a turntable you need.

TheMarlin · September 2023

sweepy said:

Old stuff is where the good sounding bargains reside

True, but grease gets crusty, and plastic and rubber perishes. Ifyou buy an old deck, keep a budget for a rebuild, more so if it’s direct drive.

I do my own, but except for the z Lenco which o bought freshly restored.

I e tried all the old Thorens decks, I lived the TD150, less so the 160, and even less do the TD160s.

I had a Garrard 401 with a SME 5 tonearm. That sounded mega. Should never have sold that.

Octavio · September 2023

I do like the idea of going with the old stuff. Similar to a guitar if I move it on I shouldn't lose much money. I see you can get a receivers with a built in phono preamp. If I invest in a top quality receiver (some even have Bluetooth) that will stand the test of time, then I can get the best of both old and new while keeping things quite tidy.

TheMarlin · September 2023

If you have an amp and want to use it with a turntable (and have a MM cart), you’re going to have to spend at least £700 to get a phono stage that gonna beat the humble little Schitt Mani.

They’re about £100-£150 new (or were last time I looked), and sound fantastic. I upgraded to a EAR phono-stage, specially tuned to my cartridge. I had it further modified to remove the power supply, and house it in a separate case which I keep well away.

It’s sounds amazing, but cost a fortune, and hasn’t embarrassed the humble Schitt Mani.

I’ve kept mine as a spare.

It’s useless on MC carts though. I had Tom Evans build the phono stage tuned to my MC cart.

#** Edited to remove shocking typos. iPhone autocorrect sucks.

Octavio · September 2023

TheMarlin said:

If you have an amp and want to use it with a turntable (and have a MM cart), you’re going to have to spend at least £700 to get a phono stage that gonna beat the humble little Schitt Mani.
They’re about £100-£150 new (or were last time I looked), and sound fantastic. I upgraded to a EAR phono-stage, specially tuned to my cartridge. I had it further modified to remove the power supply, and house it in a deprecate unit which I keep well away.
It’s sounds amazing, but cost a fortune, and has. If embarrassed the humble Schitt Mani.
I’ve kept mine as a spare.
It’s useless on MC card though. I had Tom Evans build the phono stage tuned to my MC cart.

£150 seems reasonable to get going.

Sounds like turntable should be purchased first and then work it out from there.

There's an Linn LP12 Sondeck listed local. I'm tempted.

RustySpanner · September 2023

Linns are a minefield.

As above, a 'nice' well looked after Systemdeck will sound great if you know what you're doing, it's not been stored somewhere damp (many have) and it's been regularly looked after.

If not, a Rega P3, new, or a new Technics is the way to go. Just pick a flavour.

I've had the same Rega Planar 3 for over 30 years and it's superb.
Try a Denon DL110 cartridge if you can. They are soooo good, far better than pretty much anything else at the price.

I highly recommend Wilkinsons Audio in Nelson for serviced, well set up, value for money secondhand gear.

Octavio · September 2023

They have an impressive collection. Reassuring to know they're serviced https://www.wilkinsons.tv/used-hifi-list/all-things-vinyl/turntables/

TheMarlin · September 2023

I’ve just remembered. I’ve got a fifth turntable!

it’s a Denon DP55 direct drive turntable. It’s not got a lid, but it’s an excellent turntable.

I’d let it go cheap here for £250 (no tonearm(.

I’ve got spare tonearms,

Origin Live Endounter 3c
Michelle Technoarm 2

but both are expensive.

KDS · September 2023

Rega, pick your price point.

viz · September 2023

TheMarlin said:

I’ve just remembered. I’ve got a fifth turntable!

it’s a Denon DP55 direct drive turntable. It’s not got a lid, but it’s an excellent turntable.

I’d let it go cheap here for £250 (no tonearm(.

I’ve got spare tonearms,

Origin Live Endounter 3c
Michelle Technoarm 2

but both are expensive.

what's the origin live tonearm like?

BluesLover · September 2023

If you're near this place, they'd be worth a call
https://www.retrotechaudio.co.uk/currently-for-sale.html

Rocker · September 2023

At the risk of stating the obvious, there is no one turntable/cartridge/phono stage or whatever that is the magic component in your system. It is how the combination you have or intend to purchase works that makes the difference between sounding good and sounding like music. Hence the importance of listening to the system before purchasing it. I have no idea what number of combinations of components are possible, thousands very likely, so this is why I stress visiting a hi-fi dealer who will have the knowledge of what works and what doesn’t. All the products mentioned so far in this thread are good and capable devices but buying something that is well thought of is not a guarantee that it will work optimally in your system. Listen before buying.

blobb · September 2023

If you've got nothing at all and want to listen to records cheaply, go on Richer Sounds and see what they have got in their budget systems range.

Something like this: https://www.richersounds.com/denon-dp-29f-silver-cambridge-audio-axa25-lunar-grey-with-wharfedale-diamond-9-0-black.html

Otherwise you are opening up a whole world of bits n pieces. You need a turntable, an amp with a phono stage and some speakers. This sytem won't be the 'best' you can get or even the best on a budget, but it will let you listen to records in a nice way to start with. Everything else comes later, and as you can see everyone has a different view.

TheMarlin · September 2023

viz said:

TheMarlin said:

I’ve just remembered. I’ve got a fifth turntable!

it’s a Denon DP55 direct drive turntable. It’s not got a lid, but it’s an excellent turntable.

I’d let it go cheap here for £250 (no tonearm(.

I’ve got spare tonearms,

Origin Live Endounter 3c
Michelle Technoarm 2

but both are expensive.

what's the origin live tonearm like?

I’m my opinion, an SME beater!
I’ve also got an Origin Live Conqueror, which i use on my Nottingham Audio deck. Superb tonearm

Octavio · September 2023

TheMarlin said:

If you have an amp and want to use it with a turntable (and have a MM cart), you’re going to have to spend at least £700 to get a phono stage that gonna beat the humble little Schitt Mani.
They’re about £100-£150 new (or were last time I looked), and sound fantastic. I upgraded to a EAR phono-stage, specially tuned to my cartridge. I had it further modified to remove the power supply, and house it in a deprecate unit which I keep well away.
It’s sounds amazing, but cost a fortune, and has. If embarrassed the humble Schitt Mani.
I’ve kept mine as a spare.
It’s useless on MC card though. I had Tom Evans build the phono stage tuned to my MC cart.

I bought the Mani 2. Good recommendation. Yes I realise I'm doing all this backwards! One down. Now for a turntable..
https://www.schiit.com/products/mani

blobb · September 2023

This guy does good Rega conversions.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/266390385092?hash=item3e061ab1c4:g:SgcAAOSwHTpk7hM7&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA4Lde8qpqRWa5gWP9GMFy0E39CZr%2FN0l60n8rzRK9%2FcU%2FxupbgyBl5aIp5pzm1srcbpBJ52jVUGdueTVWmFU4Rh%2BbvTdTMG6JpcaT6JOPsJbxM3yyM9Rp9mJdLPOxbbowuEhivNMDZdFMU0leoOBrW7qPL9136NFCbYfZIMaQ1HAHG1IwsdUE5JNnMf6NQdOisp0icqBkNfPCareHtfssdv815MmC9PEkVsaVqpe6eDsb0Z7GqoMrf30j41lyxZq5Riv90CR3t1Uj5gdh%2Bs89YM4uuL%2BYLLAXwEIlBEExpWa8%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR8b3y7zRYg

TheMarlin · September 2023

I’d let my Denon DP 55 go to forum member cheap. £200 for a top class direct drive deck, you’d have to spend several grand new to beat it (and quite frankly, best part of a grand used to even get close)

Just needs a tone arm.

I have tonearms spare, but expensive.

Get a Rega RB250 tonearm - can be had for £100-£150
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/394873434659?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=u0aZ_Qd7Rxq&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=3gw4Mp6ER2O&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/386113281262?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=Sr-L4FB_QlG&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=3gw4Mp6ER2O&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

£70 for a counterweight upgrade (this is the best counterweight upgrade. Awful stock counterweight ruins this arm. This upgrade add move liveliness to the tone, and reveals a strident bass.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/266396913323?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=yL_5flFySjW&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=3gw4Mp6ER2O&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY)
bolt it to the Denon, cheap and amazing sounds

If you want a cheap but great cartridge,
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/155764659865?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=4fK1DA1XRPS&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=3gw4Mp6ER2O&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

TheMarlin · September 2023

Octavio said:

TheMarlin said:

If you have an amp and want to use it with a turntable (and have a MM cart), you’re going to have to spend at least £700 to get a phono stage that gonna beat the humble little Schitt Mani.
They’re about £100-£150 new (or were last time I looked), and sound fantastic. I upgraded to a EAR phono-stage, specially tuned to my cartridge. I had it further modified to remove the power supply, and house it in a deprecate unit which I keep well away.
It’s sounds amazing, but cost a fortune, and has. If embarrassed the humble Schitt Mani.
I’ve kept mine as a spare.
It’s useless on MC card though. I had Tom Evans build the phono stage tuned to my MC cart.

I bought the Mani 2. Good recommendation. Yes I realise I'm doing all this backwards! One down. Now for a turntable..
https://www.schiit.com/products/mani

Once you get your Schiit Mani connected to your turntable, take a while to play with the dip switches on the underside. You can dial it into the impedance or your cartridge and tonearms. Once it tuned in, you’ll love it

ROOG · September 2023

blobb said:

If you've got nothing at all and want to listen to records cheaply, go on Richer Sounds and see what they have got in their budget systems range.

Something like this: https://www.richersounds.com/denon-dp-29f-silver-cambridge-audio-axa25-lunar-grey-with-wharfedale-diamond-9-0-black.html

Otherwise you are opening up a whole world of bits n pieces. You need a turntable, an amp with a phono stage and some speakers. This sytem won't be the 'best' you can get or even the best on a budget, but it will let you listen to records in a nice way to start with. Everything else comes later, and as you can see everyone has a different view.

I completely agree, @blobb , if you just want to play your records go with a simple package including phono amp or Bluetooth if that is your preference.
Its all too easy to get drawn into expensive audiophile 'mix n-match' shenanigan's, best avoided in my opinion.

Signed, "The recovering Audio-loon"

roberty · September 2023

I got a Technics 1210 in Feb 2013 for £220. It has worked flawlessly the whole time with no fuss. I might have put a drop of oil in the bearing once. Super solid and stable. I put KAB fluid damper on, but couldn't tell you if it does anything. I was young and naive. Got a nice MC cart on it now. My system is high end (PMC, Plinius, room treatment). The Technics is probably the best money I've spent. I expect it will outlast me (at this rate, anyway)

edit: 2013! Time, eh?

blobb · September 2023

@ROOG

QUAD and CAM R50's for the win!

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Calling Audiophiles. Turntable recommendation and setup

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