Digital Piano advise

bassbora · July 2023

I am kind of looking for advise or just thoughts on digital pianos. I was inspired by the thread started here the other day by @monquixote and all the advise comments that came about from people such as @thecolourbox.

Probably best to explain the use case and my limited abilities.

I took lessons for 6 years as a kid and never enjoyed it probably because it was only classical music.

I later was in a music school studying bass which was mostly jazz and improvisation. For those classes you actually needed to pass exams in jazz chords (lets just call it that) playing a piano and I actually really enjoyed it and always hoped I would get back to that. Fast forward and kids came along and never any time and no money spare for a keyboard/piano.

So when these piano ideas come up I always think of Roland because I did have access to a Roland HP700 (something not sure what the number would have been 10-12 years ago) and I was always blown away how nicely it played and sounded.

So again I saw the discussion here the other day and it made me think again and look at what is available out there. I know absolutely about keyboards/digital pianos so you get a bit overwhelmed by all the choices. So what I was looking at (and lets just keep it at Roland so I dont get too confused unless someone has a suggestion that is too good to miss) few models.  FP-30X, FP-E50 and FP-60X. Of course I ended up looking at the FP-90X and then you get tempted by the different key mechanism and sound engine and then you realise you are gone totally mad.

What I would use it for is almost just acoustic piano sounds to try and learn jazz and maybe the odd classical piece. I want to be able to put them away when not being used so I dont want a big stand/frame and I would probably only ever use this at home. Am I looking at the wrong models? You never know I might use some of the other features but at the moment I am mostly just thinking piano.

Any thoughts greatly appreciated

hessodreamy · July 2023

I've been playing for my own amusement for 30 years, without having reached any great level of proficiency. Initially took lessons and did a few exams but after school largely was just bashing out rock ballads.

Having owned a few non or semi-weighted keyboards over the years I wanted more of a piano feel and tried some out. I was impressed by the FP30 (the original, not the x). I enjoyed the feel and the sound. I checked out a bunch of demos of other keyboards in that price range (yamaha, kurzweil etc) and came to the conclusion that they're all about the same quality, so choose what sounds and feels right to you. I think the FP30 had a little less brightness that some of the competition but to me that translated as being warmer and less plinky.

bassbora · July 2023

hessodreamy said:

I've been playing for my own amusement for 30 years, without having reached any great level of proficiency. Initially took lessons and did a few exams but after school largely was just bashing out rock ballads.

Having owned a few non or semi-weighted keyboards over the years I wanted more of a piano feel and tried some out. I was impressed by the FP30 (the original, not the x). I enjoyed the feel and the sound. I checked out a bunch of demos of other keyboards in that price range (yamaha, kurzweil etc) and came to the conclusion that they're all about the same quality, so choose what sounds and feels right to you. I think the FP30 had a little less brightness that some of the competition but to me that translated as being warmer and less plinky.

I really appreciate your reply. Sounds like I am looking at gear that I would only use fraction of the capability. I will seriously look at the FP30x. Don’t know if you can still get just the FP30.

thecolourbox · July 2023

Welcome (back) to the world of piano. As fun as I find guitar, and to paraphrase Wind in the Willows, there is nothing half so much worth doing as simply messing about on the piano.

I'm a wedding pianist playing classical, pop/rock tunes and jazz on a Roland FP30X doing about 20 weddings a year. I was not necessarily blown away by the sounds of any of the ones I tried when purchasing that specific model, however both the Roland ones and the Yamaha ones I tried all sounded good so it's just a matter of taste in that regard (and bearing in mind the built in speakers and surroundings don't always help matters). Therefore all of the models you've listed there will definitely sound good, whether or not some of the higher end models have better engines or samples or what not I don't know, but in that respect I'd say you'd have to weigh up whether it would benefit you enough to override some of the benefits you'd get from going with the smallest one. Roland are a proper music company with plenty of users and support available, plus resale potential is always there should the worst happen.

I use a fold up metal frame stand, about £50 off Amazon. I did think about getting the nice white matching Roland one but I drive a go kart sized car so it wasn't going to fit in there without scuffs. For weddings I just cover it in a spandex table cloth and it looks nice, but that bit is irrelevant to you I think.

Upsides to the FP30X:

Width is obviously pretty standard on stage pianos given there are 88 keys of a standard width. However the smaller depth and height of this one is very useful for me when moving around wedding venues between ceremonies and drinks receptions etc and for storing it at home (I don't use it at home).
If you're only wanting the grand piano sounds, then it's pretty good. You can download an Android app which can finetune your preferences, brightness, resonance, tuning frequencies etc. I did that once and have left it where it is now. The other sounds range from OK to "erm", but the piano sounds good. I get lots of nice comments about the sound at weddings through my tiny Bose S1 amp.
The keys feel nice and didn't feel as heavy to me as the Yamaha I tried ( i expected to come away with a Yamaha). I find I can play softly much easier on it than my proper piano and other people's digital pianos, if that helps.

Downsides to the FP30X:

If you're using the built in speakers, they'll take some getting used to as they are underneath and point downwards, which is pretty much the exact opposite to what I'm used to on a real piano.
The more advanced models may have more sounds available - which may or may not be of interest to you.
The Epiano sound is not to my taste, I prefer the more warm sounding Wurlitzer style whereas I think this is more of a Rhodes. You may not care but I'd imagine a nice epiano sound for learning jazz would be beneficial.

General thoughts:

You won't go far wrong with a Roland or Yamaha, just down to taste in terms of sounds and feel really I guess.
You won't necessarily get a mind blowing stunning "wowwwww" piano sound unless you spend a LOT on one of the super high end ones, however the sounds are good enough and as with our guitars, a good digital setup can sound much better than a crap analogue one.
Might you benefit from a model with less keys? I think the ones you've listed above are all full 88 key models, but you might find a 73 key one suits you just fine as the "dusty ends" might not be something you need? Be careful though as to how much polyphony they can do - because while you think "i only have ten fingers", if you're holding down chords with your sustain pedal and playing solos as well that can multiply more than you'd think. Plus as you know, jazz should have as many notes as possible at all times so...
I can't remember if Roland do one, but I've always said if I were to get a second instrument to use as backup for my wedding stuff or for when I need to move quickly between spaces, I'd probably be looking at the Yamaha P121. In fact, I might well take another look at that idea, to see if that model has an epiano sound that's more me...ooohh piano GAS
On my computer desk at home for basic learning of songs by ear and production stuff I have a Yamaha MX49, on which the sounds are beautiful but the keyboard size is too small really to be useful to you. There might be a bigger one but they don't have weighted keys which may bother you. It doesn't bother me that much but I'd say if you're (re)learning on it you'd be better learning on proper piano style ones and you can adapt to other things later on
I played at a music event last weekend on another chap's FP60 (not the X) and it didn't feel as nice as my own FP30X, for what it's worth. That may be because of what I'm used to, or it may be because he had the bass up too much (I did turn it down when he wasn't looking)

bassbora · July 2023

Thank you so much for your comprehensive reply @thecolourbox. I think you have convinced me that I dont need anything more expensive. I am just hoping to play some jazz and probably only piano sounds and not much else. I probably wont hear much difference in the sounds since I have not played digital piano before (how does one of these compare to the HP702 just out of interest if anyone knows). I think it would be kind of foolish and waste of money to even think about anything more expensive than this for my needs.

I will spend the weekend looking at demos on YouTube (I have already started) and I will take it from there.

thomasw88 · July 2023

Have a look at the Casio stage pianos in your price range.
They’re actually really nice. I think with keyboards Trying a few is the best way. Sound wise there’s not much in it tbh but they do all feel different and you really need to get one that you like.

more · July 2023

I bought my first keyboard ,a Yamaha PSS-270, at a jumble sale and that has grown into a collection of Yamaha keyboards. So, I only know Yamahas . Yamaha has been making keyboards for a long time, is constantly improving them and making them cheaper. It is a buyers market at the moment , you can buy second-hand ones very cheaply. I think a real bargain, but not a actual piano, is the Yamaha PSR-EW310 . It is not a professional instrument, you can buy one at Argos for about £275 . You would need to spend over double that before you started to find something similar.

bassbora · July 2023

Thanks everyone for the suggestions. I think I will spend a little bit more time looking at it and add Yamaha and Casio in the similar price brackets. My first proper bass was a Yamaha so I always have a soft spot for those instruments.

Stratavarious · July 2023

Casio’s new stage pianos are nice and portable. Kawai, Roland and Yamaha all have nice 88 key low-mid range pianos at £600-800 that are perfectly fine for your scenario. Just try them.

I use a Roland synths for gigs and have a Yamaha Clavinova in the studio.

A Nord is looking like the next big gear purchase.

paulmapp8306 · July 2023

For me, its about choosing something with the right keybed/key action. Thats the only thing you cant really change.

The RD2000 is great, but its a stage piano so has loads of stuff you wont use and its not cheat.

the Studiologics Numa Pro GT is another great feeling board - again though with more functionality than youll need but less costly than the RD.

the FP90 isnt quite as good, but its better than the 30 by a way.

Id SERIOUSLY look at the Casio Privia range. the top end stuff is rEALLY good (again, expensive though) but all the models are a touch above anything else at their price point for pure pianos.

viz · July 2023

The yamaha ranges are pretty comprehensive and just get better and better as you spend more

thecolourbox · July 2023

thecolourbox said:

The Epiano sound is not to my taste, I prefer the more warm sounding Wurlitzer style whereas I think this is more of a Rhodes. You may not care but I'd imagine a nice epiano sound for learning jazz would be beneficial.

A point of order, I made the above comment, completely forgetting that there are actually quite a few sounds available on the epiano setting, including a Wurlitzer, by holdinf Function and pressing various different notes on the piano.

I'm an idiot

Cranky · August 2023

I keep vacillating between a Roland fp-30x and a 60x. Yes, technically I think the 60x is worth the extra money. And yet somehow I balk every time I think about the purchase. The 30x is, technically, fine. But I feel I would be missing out on the superior speakers, sound/fx options and user-friendly programming on the 60x.

The Yamaha 670 looks nice, but it doesn’t have line outs as far as I can tell.

Another concern I have, looking at used pianos, is how the tech/connectivity parts (as in for DAWs etc) will be obsolete sooner or maybe even already. Like an early 2000s model . . . a lot’s changed since then, yeah? Plus the polyphony seems to have come a long way the past 10-20 years.

bassbora · August 2023

Cranky said:

I keep vacillating between a Roland fp-30x and a 60x. Yes, technically I think the 60x is worth the extra money. And yet somehow I balk every time I think about the purchase. The 30x is, technically, fine. But I feel I would be missing out on the superior speakers, sound/fx options and user-friendly programming on the 60x.

The Yamaha 670 looks nice, but it doesn’t have line outs as far as I can tell.

Another concern I have, looking at used pianos, is how the tech/connectivity parts (as opposed n for DAWs etc) will be obsolete sooner or maybe even already. Like an early 2000s model . . . a lot’s changed since then, yeah? Plus the polyphony seems to have come a long way the past 10-20 years.

I am the same. Cant decide. There is no rush for me since this is just for my own enjoyment but I keep going from 'be sensible and get just what you need' to 'even if its more money you might enjoy it more and there for play more' to finally 'you might possibly never use it so no point wasting the money'.

I am currently in 2 bands and been asked to be part of two other projects so I am playing/practicing bass a lot and none of these projects cross over so there is not a lot of extra time. So maybe I should just be sensible and leave it for now.

Or maybe just get one and be done with it?????

First world probloms

bassbora · August 2023

Just out of curiosity would anyone buy B stock? Is it likely to be missing stuff and possibly not be working properly? I know this is a very broad question but mostly looking for people's experience of it.

goldtop · August 2023

Depends. With 88-key pianos it may well have been dropped in transit, leaving some cosmetic (or worse) damage. I've got a recollection of seeing quite a bit of Gear4Music B-stock with damage on Ebay (at not much saving).

But sometimes, it's just down to distance selling regulations and someone sent it back. So it's in perfect condition except perhaps some smudgy fingerprints.

The devil's in the detail, so ask before buying B-stock.

markv · August 2023

I bought a Roland FP-30X almost 2 years ago for home use as I'd started learning piano. I'd tried a few other models and liked this best. I'm really happy with it.

The only observation I'd add to the many good points already made in this thread is that I wish I'd bought one that has a cover. Regardless of how much I play it, it still gets dusty and if it had a built-in cover, the keys would at least be protected.

thecolourbox · August 2023

markv said:

I bought a Roland FP-30X almost 2 years ago for home use as I'd started learning piano. I'd tried a few other models and liked this best. I'm really happy with it.

The only observation I'd add to the many good points already made in this thread is that I wish I'd bought one that has a cover. Regardless of how much I play it, it still gets dusty and if it had a built-in cover, the keys would at least be protected.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/285316880090?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=Nsb21cPfRdm&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=QKaZqXqVQ_6&var=587192205818&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

I use one like this on my upright piano, my Roland never leaves it's bag at home so can't help with a specific one for that, but those look neater and nicer I think than those awful stretchy wraparound ones that Roland sell

bassbora · August 2023

goldtop said:

Depends. With 88-key pianos it may well have been dropped in transit, leaving some cosmetic (or worse) damage. I've got a recollection of seeing quite a bit of Gear4Music B-stock with damage on Ebay (at not much saving).

But sometimes, it's just down to distance selling regulations and someone sent it back. So it's in perfect condition except perhaps some smudgy fingerprints.

The devil's in the detail, so ask before buying B-stock.

Thanks for the advice. I thought that but I wanted to just see what other people thought. I don’t think I would comfortable taking the risk.

Cranky · August 2023

bassbora said:

Cranky said:

I keep vacillating between a Roland fp-30x and a 60x. Yes, technically I think the 60x is worth the extra money. And yet somehow I balk every time I think about the purchase. The 30x is, technically, fine. But I feel I would be missing out on the superior speakers, sound/fx options and user-friendly programming on the 60x.

The Yamaha 670 looks nice, but it doesn’t have line outs as far as I can tell.

Another concern I have, looking at used pianos, is how the tech/connectivity parts (as opposed n for DAWs etc) will be obsolete sooner or maybe even already. Like an early 2000s model . . . a lot’s changed since then, yeah? Plus the polyphony seems to have come a long way the past 10-20 years.

I am the same. Cant decide. There is no rush for me since this is just for my own enjoyment but I keep going from 'be sensible and get just what you need' to 'even if its more money you might enjoy it more and there for play more' to finally 'you might possibly never use it so no point wasting the money'.

I am currently in 2 bands and been asked to be part of two other projects so I am playing/practicing bass a lot and none of these projects cross over so there is not a lot of extra time. So maybe I should just be sensible and leave it for now.

Or maybe just get one and be done with it?????

First world probloms

At least you’re in bands!

I’m just a homesteader teaching myself how to do all this stuff. My kiddo is taking piano lessons, though, so I try to use her as an excuse. That’s how I got my e-drum set :-)

ICBM · August 2023

I've got the cheapest model in the Yamaha P series, for my daughter to use - mine is the P-30, the current one seems to be the P-145 - which is an 88-key with basic but good sounds, pianos and couple of others. It's not heavy, so even though it's a full 88-key, it's easy to pick up and store somewhere - it goes on a standard x-frame stand in use.

Cranky · August 2023

Just found a great used Roland Fp-60x for $850. A black one, too (white pianos look gaudy to me). Will be mine in a few days and I can’t wait. So many nights hearing my original tunes in my head but unable to sit at a piano to work things out.

thecolourbox · August 2023

Enjoy! Let us know how you get on

Cranky · August 2023

thecolourbox said:

Enjoy! Let us know how you get on

Well, it arrived with an entire octave of consecutive white keys totally stuck in the down position and no audio output at all.

So it’s back to the store and back to the start. I’m already scarred; no more used/shipped pianos.

goldtop · August 2023

:-o

That sucks. I bought a Nord Stage 3 that arrived with a broken and splintered wooden end cheek. Wasn't sure if the huge knock it must have taken would also have damaged the electronics, but it was all OK, so I thought it was cheaper to buy a new end panel than deal with sending it back.

bassbora · August 2023

I am hoping to order something tomorrow or Monday but now you have made me doubt I should do it and just get another bass

Cranky · August 2023

bassbora said:

I am hoping to order something tomorrow or Monday but now you have made me doubt I should do it and just get another bass

I would risk buying a new one shipped in its original packaging. The one I took a punt on was used but from a shop about 150 miles away. It was listed as “great condition,” but either they were exaggerating or something happened in transit.

ftumch · August 2023

Don't know if of interest here but......
https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/243784/fs-roland-bk5-arranger-keyboard-any-interest-300#latest
Price is a bit negotiable

goldtop · August 2023

FWIW, all 88-key keyboards are a nightmare to sell on. No-one wants to try to ship. Which means they can be a very cheap local buy.

So, if you don't mind used, check local Gumtree/Ebay and find the ones that are collection-only. Make a cheeky offer.

Cranky · August 2023

goldtop said:

FWIW, all 88-key keyboards are a nightmare to sell on. No-one wants to try to ship. Which means they can be a very cheap local buy.

So, if you don't mind used, check local Gumtree/Ebay and find the ones that are collection-only. Make a cheeky offer.

Makes sense. Same with amps. Wouldn’t want to ship one, don’t want to buy one shipped.

bassbora · August 2023

I thought I would just post an update to this. I decided to go with the FP60x. I looked at all the options people had mentioned here and watched and read reviews and felt like that would be the one for me. Only time would tell and it was really close between the 60 and the FP30x. It arrived and I am very impressed with it but I have not had chance to play much and probably wont until next week. Because of not that much space in my house I got a gig bag with it to store it safely. So overall very impressed.

And against thank you all with your advice and suggestions I really appreciate it and again shows how great this forum is.

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