Is there a pick-up that’s actually ok to record yet?

shufflebeat · June 2023

Oh, lord, I forgot. I have the Schertler Dyn-G as well. Hope is so much more powerful than experience.

if anybody fancies anything off that list, keep an eye on the “for sale” section

. I’m only actually using the TD, the Tak and the Mooer these days

ICBM · June 2023

shufflebeat said:

Unfortunately there’s no way to design out the laws of physics and bronze/PB don’t react to mag pickups - full stop.

No, but the steel core does. They work perfectly well - if you've got several of those pickups you already know that, since otherwise the bottom four strings would be silent.

jw_H-535 · June 2023

The best you’re gonna get is the Maton system. They sell the pickups separately, probably the top of the market at the mo. But as everyone else has said, mic’s mic’s and more mic’s if you want a good sound.

shufflebeat · June 2023

ICBM said:

shufflebeat said:

Unfortunately there’s no way to design out the laws of physics and bronze/PB don’t react to mag pickups - full stop.

No, but the steel core does. They work perfectly well - if you've got several of those pickups you already know that, since otherwise the bottom four strings would be silent.

They’re not silent, of course, but they are weedy and phasey, unlike the 1st and 2nd strings that are full bodied and loud.

Baggs suggest *dropping the pole-pieces to balance the strings but there are two problems with that:

- raising strings 3-6 to their most responsive don’t balance out the difference even if pole-pieces 1-2 are completely removed,
- strings 3-6 sound anaemic with lots of unhelpful resonances, which are now a much more significant part of the overall sound.

The only way I could make the Vanden work on the mandola was to use nickel/steel “electric” ** strings. They actually sounded great acoustically.

* It’s worth noting that the lots of mags (including the Vanden, as far as I’m aware) don’t allow adjustment of pole-pieces.

** It’s also worth noting that before the development of bronze strings all acoustic guitars, including many classic sounds, were equipped with nickel/steel strings, so don’t feel obliged to be precious about bronze.

Wazmeister · June 2023

I would be interested in your findings Bruce…

Ive just got a new acoustic that will need some form of pickup

ICBM · June 2023

shufflebeat said:

They’re not silent, of course, but they are weedy and phasey, unlike the 1st and 2nd strings that are full bodied and loud.

I haven't found that a problem with any of the ones I've used, and I'm quite sensitive to weedy thin sounds

.

shufflebeat said:

It’s worth noting that the lots of mags (including the Vanden, as far as I’m aware) don’t allow adjustment of pole-pieces.

True, but the Fishman Rare Earth - based on the Vanden - sounds fine to me. The output difference for a standard set of bronze strings is fairly consistent, so if it's preset correctly there's really no great need to have them adjustable.

shufflebeat said:

It’s also worth noting that before the development of bronze strings all acoustic guitars, including many classic sounds, were equipped with nickel/steel strings, so don’t feel obliged to be precious about bronze.

I'm not a fan of nickel, other than on certain types of guitar for specific old-blues type sounds. I much prefer phosphor bronze for normal acoustic.

In fact, even nickel is not as magnetic as steel and the polepieces still need to be staggered - hence the traditional Strat pickup design. The old DeArmond RH-C also has no B pole, and that was designed for nickel strings too.

Wazmeister · June 2023

Interesting Bruce, as Im contemplating the same issue myself...

Are these worth trying, does anyone know ?

https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/Shure-Twinplex-TL47T-O-MTQG-A-Lavalier-Microphone-Tan/3DX0?origin=product-ads&gclid=CjwKCAjw-IWkBhBTEiwA2exyO9TSgqw0q9CAInSV62l-M7y6snY-pHPxqgg8dYf_4EO1G2cyM2QBuhoCOe4QAvD_BwE

brucegill · June 2023

Wazmeister said:

Interesting Bruce, as Im contemplating the same issue myself...

Are these worth trying, does anyone know ?

https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/Shure-Twinplex-TL47T-O-MTQG-A-Lavalier-Microphone-Tan/3DX0?origin=product-ads&gclid=CjwKCAjw-IWkBhBTEiwA2exyO9TSgqw0q9CAInSV62l-M7y6snY-pHPxqgg8dYf_4EO1G2cyM2QBuhoCOe4QAvD_BwE

I’ll have a look at those, but I know these sound good (needs 48v)

https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/DPA-CORE-4099-Instrument-Microphone-Guitar/2M4F?origin=product-ads&gclid=CjwKCAjw-IWkBhBTEiwA2exyO0bf9UO6dKIr0XtfY682V-Uu0xickilHPFXx_CjHHF_eSr99PkJBDBoCpxkQAvD_BwE

shufflebeat · June 2023

ICBM said:
I haven't found that a problem with any of the ones I've used, and I'm quite sensitive to weedy thin sounds .

shufflebeat
said:

This is a conversation that has been had in instalments in this place and elsewhere and it really comes down to expectations and taste

So - we end up at the same conclusion - again.

Apologies for the clumsy formatting, on my phone.

shufflebeat · June 2023

Wazmeister said:

Interesting Bruce, as Im contemplating the same issue myself...

Are these worth trying, does anyone know ?

https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/Shure-Twinplex-TL47T-O-MTQG-A-Lavalier-Microphone-Tan/3DX0?origin=product-ads&gclid=CjwKCAjw-IWkBhBTEiwA2exyO9TSgqw0q9CAInSV62l-M7y6snY-pHPxqgg8dYf_4EO1G2cyM2QBuhoCOe4QAvD_BwE

If you have that kind of money to spend and a small format mic is what you want then the DPA is pretty amazing. I don’t have one myself but have done sound for people who do.

roberty · June 2023

I've heard this being used and it sounds amazing:

https://www.uaudio.com/uad-plugins/guitar-bass/sound-machine-wood-works.html

Turns a Piezo into a mic'd up sort of sound

Apparently Ed Sheeran used it for his solo Wembley shows

Image: https://media.uaudio.com/assetlibrary/s/o/sound_machine_wood_carousel_1.jpg

shufflebeat · June 2023

roberty said:

I've heard this being used and it sounds amazing:

https://www.uaudio.com/uad-plugins/guitar-bass/sound-machine-wood-works.html

Turns a Piezo into a mic'd up sort of sound

That’s interesting, I’ve not seen that before.

Does it involve buying a UA interface to make it work, like an iLok?

The official videos look impressive but not significantly different to using a good IR setup, which can be done for free.

Other videos by members of the public sound a bit like the Fishman Aura system (also capable of good results) but with the wrong “image” used.

roberty · June 2023

Maybe an IR would be better then. I saw it ages ago and it was a new concept to me then. UAD have ported their plugins to run natively ITB you get buy them or subscribe to all of them for a monthly fee

shufflebeat · June 2023

Anyone who’s not aware of the current state of the discussion around IRs might like to explore Cuki79’s contribution:

http://acousticir.free.fr/

marxski · June 2023

So anyway OP … stick an SM57 in front of it and report back as you have one anyway

roberty · June 2023

shufflebeat said:

Anyone who’s not aware of the current state of the discussion around IRs might like to explore Cuki79’s contribution:

http://acousticir.free.fr/

Wow have a wis

Stratavarious · June 2023

shufflebeat said:

Anyone who’s not aware of the current state of the discussion around IRs might like to explore Cuki79’s contribution:

http://acousticir.free.fr/

I use a bunch of IRs off there on my piezo acoustics and my K&K equipped mandolin.

All free too.

shufflebeat · June 2023

Stratavarious said:
I use a bunch of IRs off there on my piezo acoustics and my K&K equipped mandolin.

All free too.

It’ a really nice thing Cuki & JonFields are doing separately but in a coordinated way. I came across their projects at AGF and both of them have been really helpful. I have IRs made by them for several of my instruments and at least one of them has been included in the database, which makes me feel all communal.

Soupman · June 2023

@shufflebeat tried to follow that 'acousticir' link but it doesn't seem to work?

shufflebeat · June 2023

Soupman said:

@shufflebeat tried to follow that 'acousticir' link but it doesn't seem to work?

It’s working for me on an iPhone.

jaymenon · June 2023

iRig acoustic works like like a charm for quick recording

I recorded this with it:

shufflebeat · June 2023

jaymenon said:

iRig acoustic works like like a charm for quick recording

I recorded this with it:

Sounds lovely.

I’m a fan of the iRig. I have one for the iPad and another for stage work with folkier types. It doesn’t really operate well in a hostile environment but has a very natural sound where conditions permit.

The cable going to the mic is proper spider-web.

brucegill · June 2023

jaymenon said:

iRig acoustic works like like a charm for quick recording

I recorded this with it:

Many thanks. Unfortunately the iRig doesn’t fit on the Lowden sound hole.

sev112 · June 2023

brucegill said:

jaymenon said:

iRig acoustic works like like a charm for quick recording

I recorded this with it:

Many thanks. Unfortunately the iRig doesn’t fit on the Lowden sound hole.

Wow, how thick is the top ?

I like to have it blended with the inbuilt Baggs on my acoustic so part UST and part magnetic, makes a good combination

brucegill · June 2023

sev112 said:

brucegill said:

jaymenon said:

iRig acoustic works like like a charm for quick recording

I recorded this with it:

Many thanks. Unfortunately the iRig doesn’t fit on the Lowden sound hole.

Wow, how thick is the top ?

I like to have it blended with the inbuilt Baggs on my acoustic so part UST and part magnetic, makes a good combination

It's about 5mm around the sound hole. They laminate another bit of wood on the inside, I guess to keep that area strong.

Shadow · June 2023

brucegill said:

sev112 said:

brucegill said:

jaymenon said:

iRig acoustic works like like a charm for quick recording

I recorded this with it:

Many thanks. Unfortunately the iRig doesn’t fit on the Lowden sound hole.

Wow, how thick is the top ?

I like to have it blended with the inbuilt Baggs on my acoustic so part UST and part magnetic, makes a good combination

It's about 5mm around the sound hole. They laminate another bit of wood on the inside, I guess to keep that area strong.

My iRig doesn't fit my McNally either, must be an Irish thing to have a thick sound hole.

shufflebeat · June 2023

Shadow said:

My iRig doesn't fit my McNally either, must be an Irish thing to have a thick sound hole.

Skating over that thin ice…

Don’t worry too much about the fit. A bit of carefully placed Blu-Tac can hold the mic in place without fitting in the “proper” way.

I have a Crafter and a Takamine that I’ve done some scratch recordings with. It just about fits on one and gets Blu-Tac’d to the other, although I can’t remember which is which.

Shadow · June 2023

shufflebeat said:

Shadow said:
My iRig doesn't fit my McNally either, must be an Irish thing to have a thick sound hole.

Skating over that thin ice…

Don’t worry too much about the fit. A bit of carefully placed Blu-Tac can hold the mic in place without fitting in the “proper” way.

I have a Crafter and a Takamine that I’ve done some scratch recordings with. It just about fits on one and gets Blu-Tac’d to the other, although I can’t remember which is which.

I'm very pleased to say I had to read that back several times to work out what the thin ice was!

Good idea re the Blu-Tac. I'd be worried it might affect the finish so I'll try sticking it just inside the sound hole.

shufflebeat · June 2023

Shadow said:

I'm very pleased to say I had to read that back several times to work out what the thin ice was!

Good idea re the Blu-Tac. I'd be worried it might affect the finish so I'll try sticking it just inside the sound hole.

Apologies, that was intended to be a bit more light-hearted than it ended up.

More liberal use of smilies required.

Howdy, Stranger!

Categories

In this Discussion

Become a Subscriber!

Is there a pick-up that’s actually ok to record yet?

Comments