Daisy Tempest On Andertons - Interesting Video

Wazmeister · June 2022

I found this video about a new and upcoming luthier very interesting.

The Captain is giving her some exposure, which is good.

But, man, has she missed a trick not having one of her guitars to see/hear on the show !!!

Winny_Pooh · June 2022

She's been apprenticing with Rosie at Turnstone as of late.

She's not a experienced builder, "upcoming", nor an expert in particular but is very likeable, young and female. Not hard to see how that translates to her large online exposure on instagram and youtube when we take guitarist demographics into account.

bertie · June 2022

Wazmeister said:

The Captain is giving her some exposure,

no answer to that

Lebarque · June 2022

bertie said:

Wazmeister said:

The Captain is giving her some exposure,

no answer to that

I wouldn't put it past him.

Mellish · June 2022

I wish her well.

It can't be easy, starting out, trying to (ahem) build a reputation, so good luck to her

darthed1981 · June 2022

Very likeable girl, very best of luck to her!

Well done to Lee for giving her some exposure as well.

guitarjack66 · June 2022

darthed1981 said:

Very likeable girl, very best of luck to her!

Well done to Lee for giving her some exposure as well.

The pleasure was his!

darthed1981 · June 2022

guitarjack66 said:

darthed1981 said:

Very likeable girl, very best of luck to her!

Well done to Lee for giving her some exposure as well.

The pleasure was his!

My Labrador's tail has less wags than this place!

steveh · June 2022

Wazmeister said: But, man, has she missed a trick not having one of her guitars to see/hear on the show !!!

I think that's because she is on her second own-label guitar...ever.

Winny_Pooh said:

She's been apprenticing with Rosie at Turnstone as of late.

She's not a experienced builder, "upcoming", nor an expert in particular but is very likeable, young and female. Not hard to see how that translates to her large online exposure on instagram and youtube when we take guitarist demographics into account.

She was with Tom Sands first, and all over social media like a rash, doing YouTube "cheese, wine, and guitars" etc. Never seems to mention him now. Then with Rosie for a while, and now building on her own.

She is extremely social media savvy and has had a lot of exposure, especially considering the number of guitars she has built. Culminated a while back in a very public Instagram spat where a well-respected USA luthier laid into her, stating that one has to have paid their dues in order to be considered a "luthier", and accusing her of using the label without any substantial body of work. Very nasty and taken down quick.

Her guitars are not exactly cheap, especially considering how few she has made. Personally, I'd be looking at someone like Oliver Marchwood who has several guitars under his belt, built to a very high standard, sound great, play great, and a couple of grand less. I played one a few weeks ago and have been resisting the temptation to commission one ever since. Same for Richard Obsourne - tons of guitars under his belt, with Sam Carter playing one, and over 2K less.

earwighoney · June 2022

steveh said:

Wazmeister said: But, man, has she missed a trick not having one of her guitars to see/hear on the show !!!

I think that's because she is on her second own-label guitar...ever.

Wow.

Good to see you around Steve. We used to exchange messages back in the day on some other forums.

Bowks · June 2022

I was shocked by the pricing for a Tempest guitar, given the lack of instrument output. Personally, I'd choose a Benjamin or an Elysian, based on reputation.

The only way to really judge is with the ears though!

darthed1981 · June 2022

steveh said:

Wazmeister said: But, man, has she missed a trick not having one of her guitars to see/hear on the show !!!

I think that's because she is on her second own-label guitar...ever.

How do you know?

I'm not doubting you btw, just wondering.

I'm guessing even at 6k a pop plus she would want to make 10 or so a year to have a reasonable income given her costs.

Gassage · June 2022

I honestly think that 6k for someone literally with zero real experience, together with all of the stuff around it on insta, shows incredible brassneck.

I have yet to see a finished guitar other than the first one.

bertie · June 2022

darthed1981 said:

I'm guessing even at 6k a pop plus she would want to make 10 or so a year to have a reasonable income given her costs.

I think that's probably rather conservative

darthed1981 · June 2022

bertie said:

darthed1981 said:

I'm guessing even at 6k a pop plus she would want to make 10 or so a year to have a reasonable income given her costs.

I think that's probably rather conservative

As the guy in the prison showers who was bi curious said... "fuck me"...

I thought 6k was a lot of money - if she is only making 2 in a year... could they be as much as 20k each?

steveh · June 2022

darthed1981 said:

steveh said:

Wazmeister said: But, man, has she missed a trick not having one of her guitars to see/hear on the show !!!

I think that's because she is on her second own-label guitar...ever.

How do you know?

All over Insta; like gassage, I’ve only seen evidence of one completed guitar named, surprisingly, “Tempest no. 1”. It’s on her YT channel.

There was an attempt at her own build before that, but she destroyed it because she was unhappy with how it was turning out. Again, all very public on Insta.

steveh · June 2022

earwighoney said: Good to see you around Steve. We used to exchange messages back in the day on some other forums.

Indeed, THAT place! I detected more than a few antibodies towards those of us who’d rather spend more on steel-strings than their cars (i drive a banger), so didn’t rejoin when it moved.

I spend most of my time on nylon these days, thanks to Jonny M infecting me with his enthusiasm for that. The nylon brigade are a hugely conservative bunch though. If it wasn’t written more than 100 years ago, then it can’t be good etc. Blah!

earwighoney · June 2022

steveh said:How do you know?

All over Insta; like gassage, I’ve only seen evidence of one completed guitar named, surprisingly, “Tempest no. 1”. It’s on her YT channel.

There was an attempt at her own build before that, but she destroyed it because she was unhappy with how it was turning out. Again, all very public on Insta.

It's incredible she's already had endorsements with capo makers and barely finished a handful of instruments.

She has an incredible number of followers. I thought of who might be considered to be at the top of the tree for steel strings, first name to pop into my head is Jason Kostal, he has around 5k followers, Daisy Tempest has 5 times the number!

What do you think of the quality of her work Steve?

steveh said:

earwighoney said: Good to see you around Steve. We used to exchange messages back in the day on some other forums.

Indeed, THAT place! I detected more than a few antibodies towards those of us who’d rather spend more on steel-strings than their cars (i drive a banger), so didn’t rejoin when it moved.

I spend most of my time on nylon these days, thanks to Jonny M infecting me with his enthusiasm for that. The nylon brigade are a hugely conservative bunch though. If it wasn’t written more than 100 years ago, then it can’t be good etc. Blah!

I started lurking there again, Jonny M truly is a fantastic guitarist!

We exchanged some messages on AGF as well a while back, the video of you playing a Bown OM was vital for when I chose Amazon Rosewood for my 00 build a few years back!

Good to hear you are still enjoying playing nylon strings. As much as I like steel strings, there's something about playing nylon strings which I seem to enjoy a little more. I recall you had a Woodfield guitar at one point right? What's your classical guitar of choice now. There seem to be a lot of very good English nylon string guitar makers now, seems to be a good time for the industry.

Jez6345789 · June 2022

I sort of bumped into her when she was doing stuff and apprenticing with Tom Sands during lockdown from her tone on Anderson video I presume that 2 years did not end well as she now refers to him as another luthier. Quiet rightly she refers to Rosie at Turnstone with a lot more warmth she is a genuine time served talent and probably still under appreciated.

I do wish her well but it will be a long slog building a reputation in that market and there are only 2 ways in my mind when starting out is you build fast and keep prices fair for a new builder giving people a good bang for the their buck as you gain experience and reputation or as she says she is a perfectionist so I imagine her speed is pretty pedestrian at this point.

it is a dilemma with all new luthiers when you build 6-10 guitars a year realistically how good are you really in comparison to the guy who voices and braces 300 guitars a year as part of a team at one of the small shop producers.

But hey everyone has to get their start and hopefully her social skills bring her some customers happy to drop 6k+

darthed1981 · June 2022

Well I do wish her luck, sounds like she both loves her job and cares about her work, we should all be so lucky!

bertie · June 2022

darthed1981 said:

she both loves her job and cares about her work,

I do

darthed1981 · June 2022

bertie said:

darthed1981 said:

Well I do wish her luck, sounds like she both loves her job and cares about her work, we should all be so lucky!

I do

You want to marry her?

bertie · June 2022

darthed1981 said:

bertie said:

darthed1981 said:

Well I do wish her luck, sounds like she both loves her job and cares about her work, we should all be so lucky!

I do

You want to marry her?

no ya wazzzuk

I love my job and care about my work

(perhaps I should've edited the quote)

darthed1981 · June 2022

bertie said:

darthed1981 said:

bertie said:

darthed1981 said:

Well I do wish her luck, sounds like she both loves her job and cares about her work, we should all be so lucky!

I do

You want to marry her?

no ya wazzzuk

I love my job and care about my work

(perhaps I should've edited the quote)

Oh I see, well, I'm glad for you mate.

bertie · June 2022

darthed1981 said:

Oh I see, well, I'm glad for you mate.

it started off being a "joke" but lost its way somewhat...........................................I know the feeling

BillDL · June 2022

So does Joe Lycett

darthed1981 · June 2022

BillDL said:

So does Joe Lycett

Hideously off-topic, but the police investigating that is terrifyingly Orwellian. We live in, Orwellian Times, as a great man once said.

The guy/girl who went to a comedy show and reported one of the jokes to the police can seriously go fuck themselves.

steveh · June 2022

earwighoney said:
She has an incredible number of followers. I thought of who might be considered to be at the top of the tree for steel strings, first name to pop into my head is Jason Kostal, he has around 5k followers, Daisy Tempest has 5 times the number!

What do you think of the quality of her work Steve?

Yes, I noticed that: Zillions of followers compared to someone like Jason who, I agree completely, is "at the top of the tree".
However, I suspect the vast majority are unlikely to be dropping 6K on a steel-string and aren't there for the lutherie thrills. Rather, they're there for the "young-woman-doing well-in-a-man's-craft" vibes, and I must applaud her for that.

Regarding the quality of her work, I have no idea - there are only two finished guitars.
It's also difficult to predict because she was with Tom and Rosie for limited time: Tom was with Somogyi for > 2 years.
Also, Tom and Rosie build rather different instruments to each other (accepting that both are modern steel-strings), so even if Tempest can build as well, I'd find it hard to predict their flavour without playing.
In any event, she's going to have to be pretty damn good to justify the price hike over some of the other luthiers mentioned here.

earwighoney said:
the video of you playing a Bown OM was vital for when I chose Amazon Rosewood for my 00 build a few years back!

I recall you had a Woodfield guitar at one point right?

Ralph is a great contrast as it happens: ZERO social media activity, not even a website. Hundreds of guitars under his belt, and a long line of people outside his front door. Only a little more expensive than Tempest.

Philip also (still playing the Woodfield): He has loads of international players using his guitars, barely any social media activity, and costs LESS than Tempest (and most of the uber-steel-string brigade). I commissioned another a while back but still waiting - his current list is over 5 years. Quality lutherie is more than YouTube and Insta.

Steel-string pricing has got completely out of hand over the last few years, a lot driven by TNAG and their hyping new builders +++, then driving the price up to accommodate their margin. Sands, Turnstone and Taran prices all doubled within a short while of joining, plus VAT as well. Yet at the same time we have nylon builders like Ambridge, Woodfield, Aram, Dean, Gee etc., all with huge international reputations, and all selling guitars for half a TNAG steel-string builder or even less, depending. Insane.

earwighoney · June 2022

steveh
said:Yes, I noticed that: Zillions of followers compared to someone like Jason who, I agree completely, is "at the top of the tree".
However, I suspect the vast majority are unlikely to be dropping 6K on a steel-string and aren't there for the lutherie thrills. Rather, they're there for the "young-woman-doing well-in-a-man's-craft" vibes, and I must applaud her for that.

Regarding the quality of her work, I have no idea - there are only two finished guitars.
It's also difficult to predict because she was with Tom and Rosie for limited time: Tom was with Somogyi for > 2 years.
Also, Tom and Rosie build rather different instruments to each other (accepting that both are modern steel-strings), so even if Tempest can build as well, I'd find it hard to predict their flavour without playing.
In any event, she's going to have to be pretty damn good to justify the price hike over some of the other luthiers mentioned here.

Philip also (still playing the Woodfield): He has loads of international players using his guitars, barely any social media activity, and costs LESS than Tempest (and most of the uber-steel-string brigade). I commissioned another a while back but still waiting - his current list is over 5 years. Quality lutherie is more than YouTube and Insta.

Steel-string pricing has got completely out of hand over the last few years, a lot driven by TNAG and their hyping new builders +++, then driving the price up to accommodate their margin. Sands, Turnstone and Taran prices all doubled within a short while of joining, plus VAT as well. Yet at the same time we have nylon builders like Ambridge, Woodfield, Aram, Dean, Gee etc., all with huge international reputations, and all selling guitars for half a TNAG steel-string builder or even less, depending. Insane.

Yes you are spot on. I think DT is also doing a great job at what you describe. She seems to be the first 'influencer acoustic luthier' I can think of, maybe it will get more young females into the profession in the long run? Only time will tell.

Is your Woodfield fan or lattice braced? I don't really have much expertise in the UK side of classical guitars, but I'm aware of some of the ones you mentioned, and occasionally when I have come across a YT video of one, I have loved the sound of them.

I'm in agreement about steel string prices going through the roof. Not just the luthiers you have mentioned, but also mass producers like Martin. A standard D28 is now £3k. The new 0-28 is £4.5k, which seems incredible all things considered.

For some of the modern TNAG builders some of those instruments seem to have such incredibly complex construction methods, I have nothing but respect for those luthiers. In contrast I also quite like the appeal of a simple lattice braced spruce/cypress nylon strung guitar....
You're right about the TNAG effect as well, in addition they also merged with Carters, a few at the Martin forum were suggesting it's the start of vintage Martin prices ramping up quickly as well, I think they pointed to a few wartime small bodies which until a few years ago weren't massively expensive had rocketed.

BillDL · June 2022

An April 2022 Daisy Tempest video just popped up in my YouTube "recommended" list, so I decided to have a look. I won't be watching any more. At the very outset she explains "Just before I go any further I should note that I'm not a guitar repair person, I'm a guitar builder - a luthier". I got a strong whiff of supremacy in that statement and from her tone, whether it was an intentional snooty put-down or not. I was tempted to stop and close at that point.

My contention is that you cannot build guitars unless you have a strong appreciation for issues that commonly affect guitars and necessitate repairs, and if you intend designing your own guitars it is worthwhile knowing why those issues occur and what design features might prevent these issues from happening on your own models, or at least you should try and mitigate them. As a "luthier" you need to be prepared to be a "repair person" and deal with warranty repairs competently and in a cost effective manner. Not every repair is going to involve removing the soundboard or back for easy access and then a rebuild and refinish.

I eventually stopped the video after seeing her pointing a heat gun from a distance at the bridge that still had the saddle in the slot, prising it off with her new unused repair spatulas without protecting the top and in a way that fortunately didn't leave half the spruce stuck to the underside of the saddle, and sanding the bridge from side to side on the bellied top instead of back and forward. I am neither a trained or qualified repair technician or luthier, but I have enough experience to be left feeling uncomfortable enough that I would not be tempted to buy one of her guitars even if I could afford one.

Mellish · June 2022

Very interesting observation, Bill. Not seen that video but will search for it

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Daisy Tempest On Andertons - Interesting Video

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