Which do Bassists Prefer?

Drew_TNBD · September 2013

Strangely, with bass it's one of those things where as long as the amp is loud and clean enough, I could get by. Also, I'm way more inclined to use pedals for the distortion than I am with guitar. Don't know why that is!

A blender of some sort is absolutely necessary for that though, because too often you end up losing all the low end.

ICBM · September 2013

Drew_fx said:

Strangely, with bass it's one of those things where as long as the amp is loud and clean enough, I could get by. Also, I'm way more inclined to use pedals for the distortion than I am with guitar. Don't know why that is!

I'm the same - it's more a question of musical function, I think. The bass tone doesn't matter anywhere near as much as the guitar tone normally. And I'm saying that as a bassist as much (or more so these days) as a guitarist! The problem is that when the amp tone isn't good enough you're really screwed.

Drew_fx said:
A blender of some sort is absolutely necessary for that though, because too often you end up losing all the low end.

Depends on the pedal. Some have more low-end than the original bass tone.

I do like layered bass sounds though, when it isn't too much of a pain in the backside to set them up. A bass with split pickup outputs so you can run one deep and clean and the other gnarly and aggressive sounds massive.

ecc83 · September 2013

"A lot of Class D designs I've seen have underrated power supplies, and rely on discharging the smoothing caps to deliver peak power - that could be it."

When I try to quote you Sporks I get ICBM!......Anyhoooses. The SPECIFIED power output of guitar amps is a very loose quantity and for valves in particular is in fact very hard to pin down. Even X watts into Y Ohms resistive at say 5% distortion still does not really tell you much about the SPL into real, reactive speakers.

But, as you also say, LF needs prodigious power compared to a 6er for comparable levels so IMHO bass amps should be be rated at sine wave power at 1kHz AND 40Hz for say 5% distortion?

Dave.

monquixote · September 2013

I think it's a bit easier to find a "good" bass sound that with a bit of EQ would probably work for most bass players probably because bass tends to be a bit more hifi.

ICBM · September 2013

The difference in volume relative to claimed power into real-world loads can be astounding.

Some time ago I tried a Fender Bassman 70 valve amp (70 watts, as you would expect) and a (claimed - although I have no reason to doubt it could be measured as such) 400W Class D mini-amp, through a huge multi-speaker ported cab - an awkward load to be sure, definitely not 'properly' designed, with no crossover between the different-sized drivers and I suspect no real tuning - and the Fender was *louder*. Not kidding. It had a huge depth at the bottom end that the little high-power amp could not deliver at all - in terms of SPL right in front of the cab the little amp might have seemed a bit louder, but in terms of filling the room the old valve amp beat it hands down.

(I don't remember the name of the little amp... something expensive though.)

Blueingreen · September 2013

Thanks for the comments on lightweight amps. How about cabs?

monquixote · September 2013

Neo speakers are what you need for lightweight cabs.

EBS make the best ones IMO, but they ain't cheap.

fretmeister · September 2013

Cabs: Bergantino CN series. Or Barefaced Bass. Alex Claber's designs are really shaking up the bass cab world. I have severe GAS for their 'Super 12' cab.

ICBM · September 2013

The Barefaced cabs are really tempting - they're so efficient that relatively low-powered all-valve bass amps become a serious possibility again.

Blueingreen · September 2013

Thanks guys. I've no immediate plans to start playing bass again, but there's always that slight temptation because good gigs are so much easier to pick up. If I thought I could get away with a much more lightweight rig, that would add to the appeal.

IanSavage · September 2013

Blueingreen said:

Thanks guys. I've no immediate plans to start playing bass again, but there's always that slight temptation because good gigs are so much easier to pick up. If I thought I could get away with a much more lightweight rig, that would add to the appeal.

It can definitely be done lightweight and (relatively) cheap these days; the Markbass / Yamaha / TC / GK gear already mentioned should do the job for you (and I'll throw the Ampef PF range into the mix as well, used one on a couple of gigs and they're nice heads).

For speakers a lightweight 1x12" is useable for smaller gigs, and the newer 2x12"/4x10" cabs weigh less than most older 2x10"s - if you're not minted enough for new lightweight stuff (I'm certainly not

) I was very pleasantly surprised by how light the Hartke VX aluminium-coned cabs are, and they go for relative peanuts on t'bay. If you want to sve your back, just steer clear of Peavey/Trace Elliot/Marshall DBS

they sound great and they're bullet-proof, but an easy lift they are not...

ICBM · September 2013

IanSavage said:
If you want to sve your back, just steer clear of Peavey/Trace Elliot/Marshall DBS they sound great and they're bullet-proof, but an easy lift they are not...

Most is, yes - but there's a really nice Peavey 2x10" in the shop I work for that's very light - 400W rated, neodymium drivers. I don't know the exact weight but it's an easy one-hand lift.

fretmeister · September 2013

I've just seen the new Barefaced cabs - Generation 3.

Oh myyyyyyyyyy! I have a full on bass chubby.

I might have to shift my beloved Bergantino cabs.

therose789 · September 2013

Having had both, they both have advantages and disadvantages.

I have had a couple of ampegs, SWR, orange and hartke and both work well but my current setup seems to work the best!

I use a sans amp going into a tone hammer (pedal version) which on smaller gigs i take a line out to the desk and then use my amp as an on stage monitor running quieter. and then for bigger gigs i use the same pedals just going into my AD200 played louder and mic'd, normally with an audix D6.

Then for really small gigs/rehearsals i can leave my amp at home and still get a great sound!

Works a treat!

BassBunny · September 2013

Must admit I can't get on with Class D amps. As a long time Markbass LMII user I have tried most Class D amps, (TC, Genz etc.), and they just don't have the "authority" or volume of the Class A/B LMII. Biggest disappointment was a Genz Contour Combo that peaked as soon as you looked at it.
Best combination I have ever used was an Eden WT550 with an EAD Foundation 212. Awesome combination.

Kebabkid · September 2013

As a guitarist who occasionally plays bass (I use a POD bean or my Roland Cube 60) I'll comment on what I've observed from the main bassist I play with. He does a lot of live sessions playing all sorts of music from funk, soul to rock, and at large venues. He loves the sound of tubes and an Ampeg SVT provided the sound he wanted, however, apart from the weight- it was also coupled with an Ampeg 8x10-the heads proved unreliable. His compromise was to switch to an SS GK rack unit with Genz Benz (light) cabs. He also has a racked POD2 in there as a back up and for fx, but mixes in another amp model to add a little growl that he was missing since giving up the SVT.
He's also used a Sansamp Bass unit DI'd to the desk - didn't 't Geddy Lee used to do this? He's also played around with Markbass and Mesa stuff so what I'm getting is that many people are switching to SS as the sound has improved, they're reliable, you don't need valve changes, big headroom/wattage in a small package and they're much lighter. The TC stuff also sounds good.

Blueingreen · September 2013

Best sound I've ever had was through an Ampeg SVT and 8 x 10. It wasn't mine, I was in a band supporting a name artist and we had to use the gear provided. Got so many people telling me it sounded fantastic but not a practical solution for normal use.

chrispy108 · September 2013

Geddy's been going direct to PA for years @kebabkid hence the racks of rotisserie chickens on stage where his rig used to be...

Kebabkid · September 2013

chrispy108 said:

Geddy's been going direct to PA for years @kebabkid hence the racks of rotisserie chickens on stage where his rig used to be...

Apart from the rotisserie, it also saves space for the washing machines and let's face it, we all need a utility stage!

Mosfed · October 2013

I use a Genz Benz Shuttle 6.2 (300W into 8ohms, 600 into 4) with the Genz Benz 12" cab and an Ampeg 15" because it is more portable - especially without the Ampeg cab. The Genz is nice too because there is a 12Ax7 - so I threw in an old Mullard and it really sweetened the sound right up.

but there is no question that money and weight not being an object I would go 100% tube. There is nothing like the sound of an old SVT. Anyone that tells you differently is deaf.

Now can you get great sound from Class D solid state, but it's just not the same.

If I had a roadie, it would be tube Ampeg all day long.

Maxi · December 2013

I like both but for out and out power I prefer valve head into a large 8X10 ,its not absolutely about an overdrive solution tho it can be, I just find the cleans pack more punch , solid state is great for moderate volume (very clean) and not too heavy to cart about . Trace Elliot do a few good heads that have the preamp valve for a bit of colour on the input .

The thing that I find negates valve power for bassists is the dreaded D.I box live or in the studio so I try to get my sound as close as I can from stomp boxes .

BluesyDave · December 2013

I've just ordered an EBS Drome Classic from Bass Direct. Small, relatively light and pokey enough for small gigs and rehersals. Its got a DI as well so could run it through the PA on larger venues. Haven't got it yet but hopes are high........we'll see.

Maxi · December 2013

The DI out could come in handy most good bass heads have one but it doesnt mean that what you hear coming out of your cab is what will be heard out front . The only way to get a pretty good chance of duplicating your on stage sound through a P.A is with a mic in front of your cab. That said even a DI out from head is preferable to DI box which basically bypasses your bass amp and gives the desk a direct line to your guitar .

One of the reasons I lost interest in live work playing bass . Thousands of pounds on my ideal rig and then 99 times out of a 100 its not even miced up .

ICBM · December 2013

This is also partly why I've gone down the FX unit route - got fed up of using my amp to create a killer bass tone and then have the soundman *insist* (even after explaining why I was using it, often) on DI'ing the input to the amp and effectively bypassing the amp, that I decided to cheat… since they don't seem to be aware that doing that when the signal has already gone through a pedalboard with overdrive and an amp simulator on it is going to give the same result

. Now, no argument. If they let me use the amp and mic it or DI the output, no problem - just turn off those bits in the FX unit. If they insist on DI'ing the input, I just set the amp flat and let the FX unit do the work… no problem.

The other part is that if there is a provided bass amp at the venue then I don't need to bother taking my own amp (which weighs 114lbs), and I can just plug my FX box into whatever is there…... no problem. The FX unit fits in the pocket of my gig bag so I can even go to the gig on the bus if I want to and not take my car. Beer… no problem

.

TheDarkLord · December 2013

There's simply no need for old school heavy valve amps anymore - in my opinion. Plenty of lightweight 500 watt heads around which can be pared with a lightweight cab too. You can coax wonderful sounds out of them.

fretmeister · January 2014

I love my Genz heads, but I do lust after the new Mesa Bass Prodigy. Not at £2000 though. Westside can fuck right off.

Blueingreen · January 2014

I agree about the SVT having the best sound but not a practical solution for me because of the weight. When I last played bass I used an SWR pre-amp into a QSC PLX 1602 and a one or two Acme 2 x 10 cabs (depending on the size of gig). Nice sound and plenty of power without any of the individual components being a back breaker. Probably not gritty enough for rock though.

I like to think if I wanted to play a bit of bass now I'd be able to find something more portable though.

Memphis · February 2014

Anyone tried the Orange cabs with one 12" driver behind the other?

Hertz32 · February 2014

I can't stand Grind or OD in my bass, Pretty much always clean for me as I am usually trying to learn to slap

I'm looking at a Fender Rumble 350 at some point because of exactly what @Pyroman said. SS all the way

tbm · February 2014

Geddys growly 70s bass sound my template sound. I've an Ashdown ABM II 575 which i *think* has a tube in the preamp, a 2x10 and a 1x15. It sounds great. As has been said, The SVTs and 8x10s are great when somebody else is lifting.

Played a show in Aderdeen years ago, and one of the other acts on the bill was Man Inc. this American dude who got sick of his office job and decided to go out on tour. It was just him playing bass and a single bass drum. The touring party was him, his tour manager and a dude whos sole responsibility was to make sure Man Inc. never had to lift his SVT and 8x10.

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Which do Bassists Prefer?

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