Anyone got any suggestions on ways of becoming a better singer?

Antique_Guitars · April 2014

Sorry not 100% sure where to post this but I'd quite like to get better at singing really like acoustic singer songwriter stuff!

Would it be helpful if I recorded something then people could give me the critique?

beed84 · April 2014

Get a few lessons and learn some warm-up exercises. One of the most important aspects is breathing (in a singing context); improve that and so will your singing.

octatonic · April 2014

Go and study with a singing teacher.

It is much harder to try to do it yourself because you will reinforce bad habits.

Once you learn to breathe properly and pitch correctly you can go do your own thing.

Look to get a year of weekly lessons.

Antique_Guitars · April 2014

Okie Dokes, well I better find full time job first then ha ha

LastMantra · April 2014

IMO the best way to be a better singer is to sing.

Record it, listen back and see what you like/don't like.

Fazer · April 2014

Antique_Guitars said:

Would it be helpful if I recorded something then people could give me the critique?

not necessarily, but please do it anyway

Antique_Guitars · April 2014

Ok ill shall try and record something short like 10 secs or whatever a bit later.

hywelg · April 2014

Whisky and too many fags.

Worked for Rod Stewart

monquixote · April 2014

Sing a lot.

In a band I was in a while back I replaced someone who did the BVs which meant I had to do the BVs.

At first I could only do basic "Yeah yeah" type stuff, but gradually all the high bits that were out of my range and harmonies that I previously found impossible became possible.

Now I haven't sung for a year or so my voice is back to being totally shit. It's true about it being a muscle.

Bidley · April 2014

LastMantra said:

Record it, listen back and see what you like/don't like.

I disagree with this. When you're starting out, you'll think your own voice sounds awful however well you sing, and you'll lose confidence.

Three things you need, really; practice, lessons, and confidence (in no particular order).

matt1973 · April 2014

Use your diaphragm.

monquixote · April 2014

matt1973 said:

Use your diaphragm.

He's trying to be a better singer not avoid pregnancy.

LastMantra · April 2014

Bidley said:

LastMantra said:

Record it, listen back and see what you like/don't like.

I disagree with this. When you're starting out, you'll think your own voice sounds awful however well you sing, and you'll lose confidence.

Three things you need, really; practice, lessons, and confidence (in no particular order).

I suppose it might. I find that it's hard to tell exactly what your singing is like until you hear it played back.

I agree with practice, as I said just sing! People play their guitar all the time and get better at it, but wonder why they can't sing when they never actually do it.

I don't think you need lessons. Depends on what you want to achieve.

octatonic · April 2014

matt1973 said:

Use your diaphragm.

The problem with that is you need to be shown how to use the diaphragm, or at least it greatly helps.

It is like anything- I could say to you 'use a plane to level a soundboard' but within that it could mean anything.

How do you tune the plane, how do you apply pressure- there are so many ways to do it wrong and doing it right is quite exacting.

Same with singing- plenty of people get by with suboptimal technique but if someone is aspiring to be a technically 'safe' singer and not stress their vocal chords then the right technique has to be taught.

IMHO of course.

Drew_TNBD · April 2014

Lessons.

I am doing them, and have been for almost two months now, as I told you a few weeks back. I just had my fifth and have my sixth booked for tomorrow. I am still shit, but it's pretty stark how much more confidence I have now to just sit in my little room and practice by myself.

The main thing to focus on is bridging your registers. I find it difficult, and I find the notes I want to hit are often right on the cusp of a register bridge, which is tricky to navigate. But I'm learning... slowly.

And I find it fun as well. It's kinda fun being utterly shit at something and have to learn things that I had no idea about!

Using the diaphragm is a bit of a misnomer. You want to focus on resonance; chest resonance, through to mixed voice, through to head resonance. This guys videos are really useful too...

Plus he looks like DiCaprio, which is pretty sweet.

Warm up exercises are not that useful, because your voice changes from day to day, even hour to hour. Focus on breathing and bridge techniques first, keep your throat open (I know you can do that one Sheldon!!) and work on your front vowel sounds.

Drew_TNBD · April 2014

LastMantra said:
I don't think you need lessons. Depends on what you want to achieve.

I thought the same.

We've gone through two singers in our band. One of them completely destroyed his voice. The other wasn't cutting it.

You do need lessons imho. It's nothing like teaching yourself guitar (of which I am no slouch) or drums (little bit of a slouch!) ... you can damage your vocal chords with the wrong technique. It's not worth doing the man thing on this!!

Antique_Guitars · April 2014

What kind of singing are you trying to do uncle drew?

Drew_TNBD · April 2014

The singy kind!!!

Need to go now. Have a gig in Colchester. Will engage upon this topic more when I am back.

LastMantra · April 2014

Drew_fx said:

LastMantra said:
I don't think you need lessons. Depends on what you want to achieve.

I thought the same.

We've gone through two singers in our band. One of them completely destroyed his voice. The other wasn't cutting it.

You do need lessons imho. It's nothing like teaching yourself guitar (of which I am no slouch) or drums (little bit of a slouch!) ... you can damage your vocal chords with the wrong technique. It's not worth doing the man thing on this!!

The evidence would suggest otherwise. Plenty of good vocalists that have never had lessons.

I really think it depends on what you want to achieve.

LastMantra · April 2014

You can damage tendons n'shit playing geetar.

pmg · April 2014

Get a good teacher and stick with the lessons

Drew_TNBD · April 2014

LastMantra;210485" said:

The evidence would suggest otherwise. Plenty of good vocalists that have never had lessons.

8-X

I'm not sure how you can know this really. There are lots of vocalists who will say they've never had lessons, but actually they have them every week, or at least a few before they go on tour, just to kick themselves up the arse.

Hell, even Stevie Wonder still sees a vocal coach!!

LastMantra · April 2014

Yup you're right, every singer must have lessons full stop no exceptions ever anywhere.

*sigh*

Drew_TNBD · April 2014

LastMantra said:

Yup you're right, every singer must have lessons full stop no exceptions ever anywhere.

*sigh*

I didn't say that you daft bugger. But if you can't even cite the ones you know, then you're argument is a stillbirth.

randomhandclaps · April 2014

LastMantra said:

The evidence would suggest otherwise. Plenty of good vocalists that have never had lessons.

So which professional singers have never had a lesson? That's just a silly assumption people make. My wife is a vocal coach and knows a fair few others and you'd find it very hard to find a professional singer who has never had a vocal coach, exactly like you wouldn't find a top athlete who did have a fitness coach. A good vocal coach isn't about telling you how to sing, it about supporting, extending and most of all protecting your voice.

It would be interesting to know what singers you know of though which provide the evidence against vocal coaching. The only one I have ever come across is Kelly Jones who finally sort out a coach after his voice started collapsing.

Drew_TNBD · April 2014

He's gonna cite someone like Bob Dylan or Tom Waits.

Sure... they make *noise* with their mouth, but they're not utilizing the full resonant system. So they are not using their singing voice, technically speaking. It's like the difference between some crappy garage punk music and your bog standard stadium rock band. Sure... the garage band is technically playing music, even though the mix is completely off, the bassist only has one string, and the drummer hasn't tuned his kit and has a broken ride cymbal.

I'm not one to lightly bow down to teachers. I can play a variety of instruments to a pretty high degree, I can mix and engineer music, and I'm pretty autodidactic in most respects. But singing is the one thing that I knew before I even started would be better taught by a teacher. Otherwise I would've been flailing around in the dark looking for the light switch.

Going through the process now of tearing down all my old preconceptions about the voice, and getting to a fundamental core that is workable. This involves being able to bridge, and I struggle a lot with it right now because I'm utterly shit. But it is a fun process of discovery

Kebabkid · April 2014

octatonic said:

Go and study with a singing teacher.
It is much harder to try to do it yourself because you will reinforce bad habits.
Once you learn to breathe properly and pitch correctly you can go do your own thing.
Look to get a year of weekly lessons.

^ this plus learning how to support your voice so you don't damage it and when and how to use the different voices you can produce i.e. head, chest etc and what shape your mouth should be making for certain vowel sounds, the dropping of your jaw, the placement of your head. It all helps.
A good teacher will assess your range too and this, with help, can possibly improve upon it or at least determine where your limit is. This will be important for song keys or even transposing them if not quite the right key for your voice.

LastMantra · April 2014

Drew_fx said:

He's gonna cite someone like Bob Dylan or Tom Waits.

Sure... they make *noise* with their mouth, but they're not utilizing the full resonant system. So they are not using their singing voice, technically speaking. It's like the difference between some crappy garage punk music and your bog standard stadium rock band. Sure... the garage band is technically playing music, even though the mix is completely off, the bassist only has one string, and the drummer hasn't tuned his kit and has a broken ride cymbal.

I'm not one to lightly bow down to teachers. I can play a variety of instruments to a pretty high degree, I can mix and engineer music, and I'm pretty autodidactic in most respects. But singing is the one thing that I knew before I even started would be better taught by a teacher. Otherwise I would've been flailing around in the dark looking for the light switch.

Going through the process now of tearing down all my old preconceptions about the voice, and getting to a fundamental core that is workable. This involves being able to bridge, and I struggle a lot with it right now because I'm utterly shit. But it is a fun process of discovery

I agree with what you and the clap are saying, most singers that are doing big tours and gigging every night will be getting "coaching" for stamina, at least. What I mean is that you don't NEED lessons to "find your voice".

Bob Dylan made a noise with his mouth? Think about it.

AFAIK the Beatles didn't take lessons. Axle Rose wasn't taught to sing like that by a teacher and didn't get coaching until he started touring (From what I have read it wasn't till the "illusions" tour, which was crap compared to AFD anyway.

Even Ian Brown has started getting coached!

You might not like Ian Brown's (Stone Roses) singing style, might not be "utilising the full resonant system", but the music is loved by many.

Drew_TNBD · April 2014

I do like Ian Browns singing style. He uses his head and mixed voice predominantly, which is how he gets that airy almost pseudo-falsetto sound. He's a lot more breathy and "wussy" sounding than you'd think. But it works with the Stone Roses stuff.

ElectroDan · April 2014

This is something, I've been thinking about for some time. Our band is female fronted and I have the job of hitting all the upper harmonies. I'm very conscious that I'm not singing technically correctly, but have learned little ways around doing what I need to do.

I posted a similar comment on here I think, some time ago. But I've been considering the Ken Tamplin course. He does seem to be the only singing coach who can sing that Bluesy/Hard Rock thing.

http://youtu.be/Rahxj-gfqsI

Pop to about 6.40 if your impatient.

thomasross20 · April 2014

LastMantra said:

IMO the best way to be a better singer is to sing.

Record it, listen back and see what you like/don't like.

+10000.
I got singing lessons. They were ok but I felt I was doing too many "exercises" as opposed to singing. I know you're meant to do some, but I felt it was a bit much.
I actually got the Ken Tamplin course - it's pricey and a bit repetitive but better than many others (where the teacher doesn't even sing!).

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Anyone got any suggestions on ways of becoming a better singer?

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