Tele Neck pickup cutting in and out

gusman2x · November 2013

I inherited a 70s telecaster (my back doesn't thank me), and since it's been in my possession, the neck pickup has been very quiet, and doesn't react to any changes in the tone knob. The bridge works fine. The middle potion behaves just like the neck position.

So, I pulled the switch cavity, and gave everything I could a good skoosh of switch cleaner. The pots are enclosed in big square plastic boxes, so I couldn't real get to them. However, I think it's actually the neck pickup, or it's wiring that's at fault. When playing, if I wiggle the pickup, then the volume increases to normal levels, but drops again when I stop. I pulled the pickup to see if there wearer any obvious breaks in the soldering, but ca't see any.

Does this wiring look OK? I'm not really comfortable to de solder and resolver the connections anyway, but wanted to know what you guys think?

http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo168/gusman2x/IMG_7500_zpse697d533.jpg

streethawk · November 2013

Can't tell. But I'm no electrician!

Could be a dodgy solder joint or you could have a worn wire somewhere along the line, or the bit of exposed wire from the black pickup lead is touching something it shouldn't?

I advise buying a 10 quid soldering kit off amazon, watching a youtube vid on soldering, practising on a piece of junk and getting stuck in. Eventually you'll happen upon the issue!

GuitarMonkey · November 2013

The soldering looks okay but a bit of insulation wouldn't go amiss to stop the two sides shorting, which I imagine is the cause of the problem.

gusman2x · November 2013

GuitarMonkey said:

The soldering looks okay but a bit of insulation wouldn't go amiss to stop the two sides shorting, which I imagine is the cause of the problem.

Some electrical tape wrapped round the two soldered joints from the pickup and wires connected to the switch?

Thanks guys

ICBM · November 2013

That wiring is definitely not original or correct. If the two loose ends are shorting against each other, or against any shielding paint in the cavity (I can't tell if there is any or not) that would kill the tone when the contact is being made. If a full short it would kill the output completely, in fact.

Before you do anything - the pickup is not original to the guitar, it's either older or newer. It should have black and white plastic wiring going right to the pickup. The black and white cloth wire either means a newer replacement, something like a Duncan 'Vintage' pickup, or a much older pickup which could be worth a fair amount, so don't go messing about with it until you know which!

Can you take another pic of the whole of the bottom of the pickup?

impmann · November 2013

Looks like a Duncan to me... old Tele pickups don't have that amount of wax/resin on them. If it is, its probably 10000 times better than the original nasty 70s Tele pickups IMHO...

At the very least, those bare connections need insulating. The plastic covered cable looks a bit weedy/grotty too. If it were mine I'd be rewiring the whole guitar to ensure it's 100%. If you aren't confident to do it, it shouldn't cost the earth at a good tech - where abouts are you?

ICBM · November 2013

impmann said:

Looks like a Duncan to me... old Tele pickups don't have that amount of wax/resin on them.

I thought so too, but i wouldn't want to mess it up if it turns out to be a really old one

.

impmann said:
The plastic covered cable looks a bit weedy/grotty too. If it were mine I'd be rewiring the whole guitar to ensure it's 100%.

That's the original 1970s plastic wiring, and hence valuable

. Actually there's nothing wrong with it - you don't need much thickness for the microamps in a guitar circuit.

Tape over the connections at the very least though.

The problem is a short not an open circuit if it sounds muffled and makes the middle position the same, anyway.

gusman2x · November 2013

ICBM said:

That wiring is definitely not original or correct. If the two loose ends are shorting against each other, or against any shielding paint in the cavity (I can't tell if there is any or not) that would kill the tone when the contact is being made. If a full short it would kill the output completely, in fact.

Before you do anything - the pickup is not original to the guitar, it's either older or newer. It should have black and white plastic wiring going right to the pickup. The black and white cloth wire either means a newer replacement, something like a Duncan 'Vintage' pickup, or a much older pickup which could be worth a fair amount, so don't go messing about with it until you know which!

Can you take another pic of the whole of the bottom of the pickup?

Hope these pics are OK.

Yeah I thought it a bit strange that the pickup had cloth wiring, but plastic for the rest of the wiring. The guitar is a 74 (I think) It was my father in law's. He died about 25 years ago, so it's certainly not been tinkered with in that time. I believe he was quite handy though, so he may well have done some things himself. There appears to be no shielding in any of the cavities.

http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo168/gusman2x/IMG_7502_zpsdeaea0c9.jpg

http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo168/gusman2x/IMG_7504_zps2d8b9864.jpg

http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo168/gusman2x/IMG_7505_zpscf8c8e69.jpg

http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo168/gusman2x/IMG_7507_zpsea8f105c.jpg

It's INCREDIBLY heavy I've often wondered if he made the body himself. The burst looks pretty authentic though, so maybe not. And I guess heavy fenders were common in the 70s

gusman2x · November 2013

Don't know why the pics are shooing as links.I did exactly the same as last time

GuitarMonkey · November 2013

The body looks (from the limited pictures) like the real deal. I think the paint in the neck pocket is an addition and the pots are definitely not original.

gusman2x · November 2013

@ICBM Do the above pics shed any light on the origin of the pickups? I tried wrapping all the joints i could see in electrical tape, but it's just the same. Interestingly, i think it's to do with the pickup cover. When i pull up on the cover, kinda 'lifting' it, the signal comes through.

gusman2x · November 2013

impmann said:

Looks like a Duncan to me... old Tele pickups don't have that amount of wax/resin on them. If it is, its probably 10000 times better than the original nasty 70s Tele pickups IMHO...

At the very least, those bare connections need insulating. The plastic covered cable looks a bit weedy/grotty too. If it were mine I'd be rewiring the whole guitar to ensure it's 100%. If you aren't confident to do it, it shouldn't cost the earth at a good tech - where abouts are you?

I'm in Manchester. I've actually just dropped off a jag with Steve the Manchester Guitar Tech in Wythenshawe, so I'll ask him for a price when I pick up my Jag.

gusman2x · November 2013

I should maybe just have a go at rewiring it myself though. Would be pretty handy to be able to do it, and I guess it ca't be that hard.

ICBM · November 2013

gusman2x said:

@ICBM Do the above pics shed any light on the origin of the pickups? I tried wrapping all the joints i could see in electrical tape, but it's just the same. Interestingly, i think it's to do with the pickup cover. When i pull up on the cover, kinda 'lifting' it, the signal comes through.

It does actually look more like a very old Fender one than a Duncan or other modern pickup, although I can't be sure. Be careful!

It could be the cover - if the tab beside the wire hole is cutting into the cloth and shorting. The best way to fix that would be to remove the two short pieces of cloth wire (even if they're original to the pickup) and solder the plastic wire directly into the eyelets… but this is not a job for an amateur if you think the pickup might be something valuable.

Lixarto · November 2013

Any chance of pictures of the whole guitar?

ThePrettyDamned · November 2013

If you're really concerned, ask @theguitarweasel, he's a top chap and may be able to help.

gusman2x · November 2013

I inherited the guitar from my late father in law. I never actually met him as he died when my wife was little. It's also where I got the Vibrolux, which is just sublime.

http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo168/gusman2x/Guitars/IMG_0419_zps194594aa.jpg

http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo168/gusman2x/Guitars/IMG_0421_zpsdbb3c941.jpg

http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo168/gusman2x/Guitars/IMG_0422_zps7a0ce94c.jpg

Apart from the neck pickup not working at them moment, it's a really nice guitar to play. I've maybe set the action a bit low, so it does need a bit more tweaking. ONly downside really is the weight. It's well over 12lbs if memory serves me correctly. However, rahter than worry about that, I've decided to just play it and enjoy it.

ICBM · November 2013

It's a '77. These are indeed often ludicrously heavy - over 12lbs wouldn't actually surprise me. I had one that must have been not far off that.

Not sure if the 6-saddle bridge is original, but it does look like a real Fender one. They used them on Tele Customs and Deluxes at that time I think, but not the standard model.

Vibroluxes are wonderful amps - I also had a '77 one of those, all original down to the valves. It had an original factory defect too - a wire not soldered into an eyelet, so every now and then it would jump in volume, like a solo boost you didn't ask for! Until I fixed it. QC at Fender was a bit ropy then...

gusman2x · November 2013

ICBM said:

It's a '77. These are indeed often ludicrously heavy - over 12lbs wouldn't actually surprise me. I had one that must have been not far off that.

Not sure if the 6-saddle bridge is original, but it does look like a real Fender one. They used them on Tele Customs and Deluxes at that time I think, but not the standard model.

Vibroluxes are wonderful amps - I also had a '77 one of those, all original down to the valves. It had an original factory defect too - a wire not soldered into an eyelet, so every now and then it would jump in volume, like a solo boost you didn't ask for! Until I fixed it. QC at Fender was a bit ropy then...

That's what I thought when I checked the serial, but somone elae said to be careful of the serial numbers and to pull the neck. It's got a weird set of info on it. It says P301, 1574. That's why I assumed it was 74. I did think that the horrid tuners might be too new for 74 though. It could well be a parts bin guitar. If you look at the picture of the bridge on the body, you can see a slight gap on the treble side where the bridge doesn't cover the routing. I guess this could be an indication that the bridge is not native, or just shitty QC I guess.

http://i372.photobucket.com/albums/oo168/gusman2x/IMG_7501_zps1414fdc8.jpg

Lixarto · November 2013

Thanks for the photos!

Lovely looking thing.

gusman2x · November 2013

Lixarto said:

Thanks for the photos!

Lovely looking thing.

No Worries man. Yes, the black guard on SB is a great look. The neck is just about my favourite of all my fender guitars too. Need to get the wiring sorted so I can start enjoying it properly.

@ICBM If the pickups are older, waht age do you think they are? Are old pickups from teles worth a fair whack? I wouldn't sell them, but I'd be interested to know

ICBM · November 2013

The number on the end of the neck is a production part number, not a date. The date is the 'S7' serial number. Later, these numbers weren't used up quickly enough so you see S8 and in particular S9 number on guitars made well after those years, but I would expect a S7 to have been made in '77 or very early '78 at the latest. The pot codes would help, but they're gone - those pots are 80s Schecter ones (not sure of the actual manufacturer).

The neck pickup could be a pre-67 Fender one. I can't remember exactly when they changed from black to grey fibre pieces, but they changed from cloth to plastic wire around then. The black and white plastic wires were snipped from the original neck pickup. I don't think old Tele neck pickups are worth silly money - unlike old Strat pickups, or possibly Tele bridge ones - but it's certainly not worth less than a top-quality replacement, so don't wreck it!

The bridge pickup is most likely original to the guitar unless it has the same sort of snip and join on the wiring. I don't know for sure that the bridge isn't, either - I didn't think they put 6-saddle bridge on them (mine had a 3-saddle, and I think it was a '78 but I could be wrong on that!) but it's possible it could have been ordered like that. The slightly exposed rout at the side of the Tele bridge is completely normal.

gusman2x · November 2013

@ICBM Thanks for all the info man. Most helpfull.

impmann · November 2013

Sweet looking guitar - can only agree with ICBM on this, late 70s Teles and Strats can be utter boat anchors. Some of them sound great though - some not so. I recently rebodied a '78 Tele for a buddy that weighed in (as a guitar) at 12.5lb and it had the resonance of cardboard - I swapped the body out to an MJT one he'd bought (very light relic) in the same colour (white) and it's 100 times nicer. The neck is lovely on that one - I'm not 100% sold on the pickups/electronics, if I'm honest as they are a bit bright and a bit thin IMHO but he likes them.

He's kept the original body and its safely stored, so that if he wants to revert it to original either to sell it or whatever. The guitar looks the same though - just lighter and better sounding! :-)

gusman2x · November 2013

impmann said:

Sweet looking guitar - can only agree with ICBM on this, late 70s Teles and Strats can be utter boat anchors. Some of them sound great though - some not so. I recently rebodied a '78 Tele for a buddy that weighed in (as a guitar) at 12.5lb and it had the resonance of cardboard - I swapped the body out to an MJT one he'd bought (very light relic) in the same colour (white) and it's 100 times nicer. The neck is lovely on that one - I'm not 100% sold on the pickups/electronics, if I'm honest as they are a bit bright and a bit thin IMHO but he likes them.

He's kept the original body and its safely stored, so that if he wants to revert it to original either to sell it or whatever. The guitar looks the same though - just lighter and better sounding! :-)

That's a great idea. Never really thought about getting a MJT body for it. I'd love a nice faded candy apply red or something similar. To be fair, this one seems pretty resonant, and sustains like mad. I am used to playing jags and jazzmasters more though, so ANYTHING sustains compared to them.

ICBM · November 2013

I swapped the body on mine with a burgundy Tokai Custom Tele copy that weighed a lot less, but had a huge neck which didn't suit it. Strangely the Tokai neck made the Fender body feel lighter! Presumably just because the whole thing then just felt 'bigger' so the weight somehow made more sense. The skinny Fender neck went perfectly with the lighter Tokai body. Sadly the chap who bought the Tokai body/Fender neck one then butchered the body trying to fit a USA Standard bridge to it, if I remember...

gusman2x · November 2013

Got my tele bck from Steve Robinson in Manchester. Turns out the neck pickup is pre CBS (it's laquer dipped) but was damaged, so he sent it of to Ash of Oil City who repaired it. While it was away, Steve leveled the prets, and did a general set up. Also replaced the weird enclosed pots with cts ones.

Played it at practice last night...OH MY FREAKIN GOD! How did I not know how good tele's are???? Still a fuckin boat anchor though, but I'll see how it gets on. It feels too heavy playing standing up at home, but at practice it felt OK, because I wasn't really thinking about it.

OilCityPickups · November 2013

gusman2x said:

Got my tele bck from Steve Robinson in Manchester. Turns out the neck pickup is pre CBS (it's laquer dipped) but was damaged, so he sent it of to Ash of Oil City who repaired it. While it was away, Steve leveled the prets, and did a general set up. Also replaced the weird enclosed pots with cts ones.

Played it at practice last night...OH MY FREAKIN GOD! How did I not know how good tele's are???? Still a fuckin boat anchor though, but I'll see how it gets on. It feels too heavy playing standing up at home, but at practice it felt OK, because I wasn't really thinking about it.

Ah ... so you are the pre-CBS Tele neck pickup owner. Nice to hear it's back together and rocking

gusman2x · November 2013

@TheGuitarWeasel Are you ash then? Thanks for the speedy turnaround, and it sounds amazing!

OilCityPickups · November 2013

I am indeed Ash of Oil City fame

... glad you like the sound of the pickup.

ThePrettyDamned · November 2013

Oh my god. You had a pre cbs pickup and didn't know it?

SO MUCH MOJO. that's really, really cool.

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Tele Neck pickup cutting in and out

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