First silly EBay listing on the new forum

rpr · August 2013

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1956-FENDER-TELECASTER-USA-POTS-/400542897086?pt=Guitar&hash=item5d423793be

....gulp....

mike_l · August 2013

Fuck me gently. I've got some new LP ones sat in my spares. Perhaps I should try selling them for that sort of cash........

Adam_MD · August 2013

This is my favourite recent gumtree ad

http://www.gumtree.com/p/for-sale/farida-telecaster-black-and-white-amazing-no-difference-to-fender/1026989451

redrighthand · August 2013

rpr said:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1956-FENDER-TELECASTER-USA-POTS-/400542897086?pt=Guitar&hash=item5d423793be

....gulp....

Christ.

Is "solid shaft" a description of some feature of the pots, or how they make the seller feel?

BadBoyKane · August 2013

These are my favourite Gumtree ads, the seller has some right bargains:

http://www.gumtree.com/sellerads/1027087075

ESchap · August 2013

I've got a pair of those plus an Astron cap and the barrel knobs all from 1957 ... like a lottery win! $-)

Bet they don't sell in a hurry !!

ICBM · August 2013

It comes down to the usual thing... if you've got an otherwise all-original, great condition mid-1956 Tele with replaced pots and you want to sell it, how much difference does it make to the value - or possibly to whether the buyer wants it at all - to have "original" pots in it? (Or at least, ones that can't be proved as non-original...)

I would suspect quite a lot, to some buyers. Microscopically small market probably, but there's a possibility they are worth that much to someone.

I didn't say I would pay that much

.

OilCityPickups · August 2013

Problem is ... as soon as you disturb the solder the whole loom is 'unoriginal' so soldering in a pair of knackered old 'twisty-cans' is as valid as fornication in the cause of virginity ... and simply goes to prove that some sectors of the 'market' are severely up their own sphincters

ICBM · August 2013

I agree! But it is a fact that some people will pay stupid prices for old parts - amp parts which are a liability in a working amp, as well as guitar parts.

It's also possible to redo the soldering well enough that you can't easily tell it's not original - there are some people who even deliberately age it.

'Re-replaced original parts' are still worth more to a collector than modern parts, even if less than completely untouched.

I know we both think it's daft, but while the valuing of originality over functionality continues, old parts will sell.

goldtop · August 2013

What ICBM said. I had to bite the bullet, pay through the nose (and mix other metaphors) for some fifties LP pots. The guitar was already unoriginal with '70s pots and caps in, but now it's restored to original condition and (at least in a healthy market) worth more than the cost.

In the early 2000s many unloved 2xHB Gibsons got pulled to bits to restore old LPs that had their electronics upgraded in the '70s and '80s.

goldtop · August 2013

What ICBM said. I had to bite the bullet, pay through the nose (and mix other metaphors) for some fifties LP pots. The guitar was already unoriginal with '70s pots and caps in, but now it's restored to original condition and (at least in a healthy market) worth more than the cost.

In the early 2000s many unloved 2xHB Gibsons got pulled to bits to restore old LPs that had their electronics upgraded in the '70s and '80s.

impmann · August 2013

Erm, well, if a guitar has been played and had the pots replaced in the 1970s its actually had the replacement parts for longer than it had the originals. And then it has become part of its history...

I mean, Jimmy Page's No1 has a T-Top fitted... does that make it worth less than if he refitted a PAF from a random 50s Gibbo? Rory Gallgher's Strat had all manner of replacement parts - because they wore out.

The vintage market is so far up its own arse it needs a torch.

ICBM · August 2013

Yes, but if you were trying to sell an instrument in that market, would you want to maximise the sale price of it or not?

impmann · August 2013

True... and I guess I'm just down with the latest fashions.

ICBM · August 2013

What I find really silly is keeping old *knackered* parts - either in the guitar, or even 'somewhere safe'... if they've been taken out because they're no good, they don't belong anywhere other than in the bin. (Or recycling, if you want to be responsible.) They don't actually add value, no matter what collectors say.

A friend of mine has several old Fenders, most of which have crackly pots, iffy switches etc, and he won't let me change them because they're 'original'. It's not as if these are collector-grade, mint condition guitars either - they're all worn, repaired, in some cases refinished... ie replacing the faulty parts is not going to make the slightest difference to the 'value' as an object, but will make a big difference to the value as a musical instrument.

People keeping - or worse, buying or selling - old electrolytic caps from amps is even more ludicrous. They get taken out for a good reason, because they either have failed or will do so, possibly causing damage to the rest of the amp, and they are dangerous to put back in. I always chuck them out, to prevent that sort of idiocy... and because even 'kept safe' they can sometimes leak nasty chemicals.

It is quite possible those Tele pots are past it too - no way of telling from the outside.

impmann · August 2013

/\ Exactly!

Some of the discussions on 'other forums' about Joe Bonamassa refretting his flametop late 50s Les Paul was hilarious. Yes it isn't original any more - but its being used for the purpose for which it was originally made. And the old ones were worn out... QED.

Otherwise, what is the flipping point of the damn guitar?

My '72 Tele has had the original neck replaced (badly broken) and it improved the guitar 1000-fold as the new neck is nicer to play, plus doesn't have huge divots out of the fret board. The original pickups are history too - the original bridge pickup was HORRIBLE; it was shrill and squeeled like a pig. The electronics went in the bin, as that was what they were fit for. Would I search out original spec bits to return my guitar to 'original condition'... don't be soft! Its now a better instrument than it has ever been... the original neck has been repaired, and the new owner concedes that it isn't a nice one (its sat in the top of his wardrobe now, having tried to work with it) so I could reunite it, but why would I? And anyway, if I ever sold it (which is about as likely as an honest politician's promise) it wouldn't make a shit of difference to the value, as its beaten to hell and its a player's guitar, not a collectors one.

But hey, that's just my opinion... and its up to others to do what they want.

goldtop · August 2013

impmann said:

Erm, well, if a guitar has been played and had the pots replaced in the 1970s its actually had the replacement parts for longer than it had the originals. And then it has become part of its history...

I mean, Jimmy Page's No1 has a T-Top fitted... does that make it worth less than if he refitted a PAF from a random 50s Gibbo? Rory Gallgher's Strat had all manner of replacement parts - because they wore out.

The vintage market is so far up its own arse it needs a torch.

The vintage market is just a lot of individuals - players, collectors, investors - making decisions up as they go along. It is what it is, and some things will look daft, but - in financial terms - they make sense. You don't have to play in the vintage market if you don't want to.

Of course, Page's #1 would be worth less if it was restored with a vintage-correct PAF/etc. But that's a special case (celebrity guitar values, etc).

carlos · August 2013

On Gumtree, not ebay. And only silly because I wouldn't pay that much for a guitar - http://www.gumtree.com/p/for-sale/klein-bf-96-electric-guitar/1026886782

octatonic · August 2013

georgenadaintl;4970" said:
On Gumtree, not ebay. And only silly because I wouldn't pay that much for a guitar - http://www.gumtree.com/p/for-sale/klein-bf-96-electric-guitar/1026886782

I wouldn't pay for than 3k for a Lorenzo Klein, myself.

carlos · August 2013

They're going for around 5k USD on ebay, so that's around 3k GBP more or less. Seems reasonable although there are a lot of luthiers these days doing versions of this body shape with similar features.

octatonic · August 2013

Yes I play a Forshage Orion.

I actually wouldn't buy a Klein now- I'd just get another Forshage.

The lack of a truss rod in the Kleins is a major stumbling block for me.

carlos · August 2013

I play a Vigier so lack of truss rod is no biggie but... do Kleins have any system to account for shifting temperatures/humidity etc? Or is it just a case of relying on the quality of the build for the wood not to shift? I know the Vigier will never budge no matter what, but not sure I could trust an all wood neck.

octatonic · August 2013

They have a biggish rosewood neck.

Vigiers still have carbon fibre inserts though, don't they?

carlos · August 2013

10% of neck is carbon fibre so pretty much unmoveable. You'd better like the relief they have, though, as you're stuck with it!

octatonic · August 2013

georgenadaintl said:

10% of neck is carbon fibre so pretty much unmoveable. You'd better like the relief they have, though, as you're stuck with it!

Yes this is why I haven't gone for one- I like a degree of flexibility in the setup.

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First silly EBay listing on the new forum

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