Is the body shape even correct on cheaper Les Pauls?

Nerine · October 2023

Perhaps it’s me.

I was just looking through Reverb. Saw some LP Tributes and Satins and stuff like that. The ranges underneath the Standards and Classics etc.

I can’t put my finger on it, but they just don’t look quite correct to me.

They look swollen and cumbersome. Almost a bit awkward. They (for whatever reason) just make my brain tweak a bit when I see them because they just look a bit “wrong” and I don’t know why.

Anyone else think they look a bit janky? Could be how they’re appointed or a lack of binding or a different carve or something, but an R* LP generally looks totally different. More svelte and curvy, somehow. Thinner. Less chunky looking.

Anyone else think the same?

skunkwerx · October 2023

I sometimes see LP's of various ilk and have the same instant reaction. Other brands, the body shape is obviously what it is, but Gibson vs Gibson, I'd have to have a proper look.

I bet it could be a satin finish thing!

I have a similar thing whenever I see one without a pickguard. I like both looks, but when the pickguard is not there, it makes the whole shape look different somehow haha.

stickyfiddle · October 2023

The top carve is certainly not the same as move from Studios & Tributes up to Custom Shop stuff. I'm honestly not sure at what point(s) it changes. Also the lack of binding can be a bit of an optical illusion where sometimes you can't perfectly see the edge where the top meets the sides, which can make unbound ones look a bit fat

OilCityPickups · October 2023

I believe some of the Tributes etc may have slightly thinner bodies ... and if you are talking unbound, then this makes the body look a bit bigger - but as far as I know all Gibson LPs are the same basic body template.

Image: https://cdn11.bigcommerce.com/s-hvzya2q3vy/images/stencil/960w/products/42754/109012/gbslptr00fhnh1_134208__19959.1632923930.jpg?c=1

Looking at a Tribute, the lack of a 'poker chip' and binding means it looks odd on the top bout ... and the body looks thinner than say my Studio Flametop.

Basher · October 2023

I've read a lot of comments about the LP top carve, particularly how it gets more accurate the more $$$ you pay.

Is it a general principle that the more accurate models just have a more pronounced, dished top curve or is it more subtle than that, in that there's a more correct shape that the originals had?

Knowing Gibson, I'm guessing it's something that changed over time anyway even with vintage guitars (a bit like neck profiles).

stickyfiddle · October 2023

Basher said:

I've read a lot of comments about the LP top carve, particularly how it gets more accurate the more $$$ you pay.

Is it a general principle that the more accurate models just have a more pronounced, dished top curve or is it more subtle than that, in that there's a more correct shape that the originals had?

Knowing Gibson, I'm guessing it's something that changed over time anyway even with vintage guitars (a bit like neck profiles).

Good thread here: https://www.mylespaul.com/threads/the-definitive-top-carve-thread.435924/

I haven't read the whole thing but the first page is good.

Neil · October 2023

Basher said:

I've read a lot of comments about the LP top carve, particularly how it gets more accurate the more $$$ you pay.

Is it a general principle that the more accurate models just have a more pronounced, dished top curve or is it more subtle than that, in that there's a more correct shape that the originals had?

Knowing Gibson, I'm guessing it's something that changed over time anyway even with vintage guitars (a bit like neck profiles).

I think that is true.

In my experience Standards etc have a more dished top (which demands more handiwork) whilst the cheaper models have a more rudimentary finished top.

timmypix · October 2023

In terms of pure outline shape, the Tributes etc are the same shape, just minus binding and a poker chip which can trick your eye slightly - makes them look less defined. Top carves are a separate issue, IMO, as they vary so much!

But yes, modern Gibson USA Les Pauls are all the same shape, from Tributes to Studios to Standards. Why Epiphone can't get that right, particularly when they're owned and licensed by Gibson, is beyond me.

WezV · October 2023

Neil said:

In my experience Standards etc have a more dished top (which demands more handiwork) whilst the cheaper models have a more rudimentary finished top.

There is no hand work going into the carves of any of them. There is no one hand shaping the recurve with a scraper. Just a slightly different program on the CNC these days.

It probably takes a few extra seconds for the CNC to do the deeper carves, which all adds up in a factory setting

OilCityPickups · October 2023

I have 'side by sided' The top curve on my Stusio Flametop with another - slightly earlier- Studio ... and my 2014 model has a more pronounced carve ... so not even consistency between models in top carve! Go figure!

stickyfiddle · October 2023

@wezV and well worth noting that neither the regular Standards nor CS ones are priced on a cost+margin basis, so any extra is almost certainly irrelevant to the RRP.

All of them will get hand sanded & buffed, but that will have a miniscule impact on the overall top carve

WezV · October 2023

stickyfiddle said:

@wezV and well worth noting that neither the regular Standards nor CS ones are priced on a cost+margin basis, so any extra is almost certainly irrelevant to the RRP.

All of them will get hand sanded & buffed, but that will have a miniscule impact on the overall top carve

The studios and tributes have much smaller margins, and it will make a difference there, just like it did in the Norlin Era when carves became quite flat

Everything these days will be set up so the absolute minimum of hand sanding is needed.

Although I think they used to be done on a duplicarver and finished with a large loose belt sander. One with a long wide belt that gets pushed down onto the carve - this method does allow for a lot more variability

WezV · October 2023

This is the slack belt sander they used to use

The guitar sits in the cradle, and those pads are used to push the belt down onto the body

One of the biggest contributors to random carves and neck angles on LP's

stickyfiddle · October 2023

Does anyone know if they're properly CNC-ing neck joints yet?

Philly_Q · October 2023

stickyfiddle said:

Does anyone know if they're properly CNC-ing neck joints yet?

No, but I doubt it very much....

Esoterick · October 2023

timmypix said:

In terms of pure outline shape, the Tributes etc are the same shape, just minus binding and a poker chip which can trick your eye slightly - makes them look less defined. Top carves are a separate issue, IMO, as they vary so much!

But yes, modern Gibson USA Les Pauls are all the same shape, from Tributes to Studios to Standards. Why Epiphone can't get that right, particularly when they're owned and licensed by Gibson, is beyond me.

My Tribute came with a poker chip in the bag with all the other accessories.

timmypix · October 2023

Esoterick said:

timmypix said:

In terms of pure outline shape, the Tributes etc are the same shape, just minus binding and a poker chip which can trick your eye slightly - makes them look less defined. Top carves are a separate issue, IMO, as they vary so much!

But yes, modern Gibson USA Les Pauls are all the same shape, from Tributes to Studios to Standards. Why Epiphone can't get that right, particularly when they're owned and licensed by Gibson, is beyond me.

My Tribute came with a poker chip in the bag with all the other accessories.

Oh that's cool! But in most stock/product photos they're without, which is what contributes to eye trickery.

Esoterick · October 2023

timmypix said:

Esoterick said:

timmypix said:

In terms of pure outline shape, the Tributes etc are the same shape, just minus binding and a poker chip which can trick your eye slightly - makes them look less defined. Top carves are a separate issue, IMO, as they vary so much!

But yes, modern Gibson USA Les Pauls are all the same shape, from Tributes to Studios to Standards. Why Epiphone can't get that right, particularly when they're owned and licensed by Gibson, is beyond me.

My Tribute came with a poker chip in the bag with all the other accessories.

Oh that's cool! But in most stock/product photos they're without, which is what contributes to eye trickery.

Yeah they definitely look different without them. I assumed they were always aftermarket addons until I heard something rattling around in the pouch on the gig bag.

I do think gloss finishes emphasise curves on the guitar body, or matt ones hide them depending on which way you look at it.

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Is the body shape even correct on cheaper Les Pauls?

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