Intonation bother

joshahobbs17 · October 2023

I’ve got a guitar with a tunomatic bridge with a problem on the D string.

It’s in tune. Harmonic at the 12th fret is fine but when I fret that note it’s a bit flat despite the rest being ok.

I can’t tighten the saddle any more than it is so I can’t seem to fix it. Any suggestions here or is this a potential issue with the guitar I need to get looked at?

digitalkettle · October 2023

Has it been okay before? Could be a bad string.

Could be pole-pieces too close to the strings.

Which way around is the saddle...could flipping it around give you some more adjustment?

A pic or two might help diagnosis.

BigPaulie · October 2023

So if it's flat at the 12th fret you need to move the saddle towards the nut, shortening the string. So I assume from this when you say "tighten" your adjustment screw heads are facing inwards towards the frets? If they're facing outwards towards the tail piece tightening the screws will move the saddle towards the tail piece, lengthening the string.

When you say you can't tighten it any more, is it stuck or is it at the limit of its travel?

If it is and the slope of the saddle leans away from the nut you can get a little more range by taking the saddle out and rotating it 180 so the slope leans away from the tail piece.

joshahobbs17 · October 2023

Maybe I’ll restring and see if the issue still continues. The saddle is set up with the flat end closest to the string so don’t think it can get any closer. I’ll try and put a pic up later.

BigPaulie · October 2023

What gauge of strings are you using? Is it an ABR or Nashville type?

ICBM · October 2023

If it's a typical far-east tune-o-matic with the top three saddles angled one way and the bottom three the other, the problem is simple - the D saddle (and probably the A, and possibly the E) is on backwards. They come like that from the factory, in order to make it possible to fit the bridge either way round depending on which side you want the intonation screws. In practice, it's usually hard to get the D to intonate correctly. The first thing I do when setting up a guitar with one of these is flip all the saddles round the right way, with the vertical face towards the neck. It's very rare that even the low E won't set correctly like this, and I don't think I've ever had to re-reverse the A.

joshahobbs17 · October 2023

Thanks all. The vertical side is facing the neck, with the screws on the side closest the nut. Tightening the screw has moved it to the limit of its travel closest to the nut, rather than the tail piece. There’s nothing more that can be done there apart from changing the string and seeing if that helps?

ICBM · October 2023

joshahobbs17 said:

Thanks all. The vertical side is facing the neck, with the screws on the side closest the nut. Tightening the screw has moved it to the limit of its travel closest to the nut, rather than the tail piece. There’s nothing more that can be done there apart from changing the string and seeing if that helps?

Sounds like you may need a bridge with a wider travel - but try changing the string first. What brand and gauge are they?

joshahobbs17 · October 2023

D’addario 10 gauge

ICBM · October 2023

joshahobbs17 said:

D’addario 10 gauge

Nothing unusual then... looks like you probably need a wider bridge, eg the Gibson Nashville type.

PAL · October 2023

String height an have an effect on intonation.

joshahobbs17 · October 2023

PAL said:

String height an have an effect on intonation.

The action feels ok to me, though I noted if I pressed really hard then it would be that little bit sharper and intimate correctly, but fretting normally every where else is fine…

Funkfingers · October 2023

joshahobbs17 said:
if I pressed really hard then it would be that little bit sharper …

That is the basic Physics of any stringed and fretted musical instrument.

•

Many years ago, a bloke in my area returned his brand new Gibson LP Studio to the local music shop, complaining that it would not play in tune. The shop agreed to adjust it. This done, the owner continued to complain. He insisted that the guitar be returned to Rosetti for attention. It was. When the guitar returned, it STILL played sharp but only in the hands of the purchaser. Turned out he was a fret strangler.

Don't be that guy.

joshahobbs17 · October 2023

Aye. But this is one note on one spot on the guitar, rather than me having problems playing elsewhere…

ICBM · October 2023

If it’s *only* the 12th-fret note that’s playing flat, is the neck pickup adjusted too high? The magnetic pull can create a ‘false node’ - although it’s most common on Strat-type guitars on the low E and sometimes A and G strings, it’s probably worth checking by lowering the pickup temporarily.

joshahobbs17 · October 2023

Yes it is only that note. I’ll have a look

PAL · October 2023

joshahobbs17 said:

PAL said:

String height an have an effect on intonation.

The action feels ok to me, though I noted if I pressed really hard then it would be that little bit sharper and intimate correctly, but fretting normally every where else is fine…

Your action may feel OK but I would set the neck straight adjust the action to around 4/64 then check into nation.

joshahobbs17 · October 2023

Soooo, when I checked again today (I was out when reply to a lot of these comments before) I realised that the saddle wasn’t sat with the flat side facing the neck. I flipped it as recommended and I believe I have fixed it. Cheers all.

digitalkettle · October 2023

joshahobbs17 said:

Soooo, when I checked again today (I was out when reply to a lot of these comments before) I realised that the saddle wasn’t sat with the flat side facing the neck. I flipped it as recommended and I believe I have fixed it. Cheers all.

I’ll claim that one…first reply

BigPaulie · October 2023

digitalkettle said:

joshahobbs17 said:

Soooo, when I checked again today (I was out when reply to a lot of these comments before) I realised that the saddle wasn’t sat with the flat side facing the neck. I flipped it as recommended and I believe I have fixed it. Cheers all.

I’ll claim that one…first reply

Good call!

joshahobbs17 · October 2023

digitalkettle said:

joshahobbs17 said:

Soooo, when I checked again today (I was out when reply to a lot of these comments before) I realised that the saddle wasn’t sat with the flat side facing the neck. I flipped it as recommended and I believe I have fixed it. Cheers all.

I’ll claim that one…first reply

Have some well deserved wisdom

elstoof · October 2023

10 points to Gryffindor

digitalkettle · October 2023

joshahobbs17 said:

digitalkettle said:

joshahobbs17 said:

Soooo, when I checked again today (I was out when reply to a lot of these comments before) I realised that the saddle wasn’t sat with the flat side facing the neck. I flipped it as recommended and I believe I have fixed it. Cheers all.

I’ll claim that one…first reply

Have some well deserved wisdom

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