A Tortoiseshell Thread

stickyfiddle · September 2023

As some of us are definitely fans of nice looking tortoiseshell guards, I thought this might be an interesting one to keep as a resource for the various suppliers and to give those who might be wondering a bit more info why someone might choose to spend money on a specific piece of plastic.

My reference has basically always been the 60s Fender guard on my home-built Jazzmaster. It's pretty warped and a little bit shrunken, so it was quite frankly a steal. But when I'm building something I'm not about to shell out current prices to get something that looks even vaguely right.

So.. Since building that JM I've had guards Lava, Avantguard, Fender Custom Shop, one listed as "WD wide-bevel aged by 'Boots' " from eBay, and one generic printed thing that came from MJT but is utterly horrible.

I've just received a new P-bass one from Lava that will go on my ongoing build, so it feels like a good time to do a bit of comparison.

Original 60s Fender:
I assume this is late-60s when the black line started getting thicker, but it's nowhere near a modern one, and absolutely lovely either way

Image: https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5482/31045049841_71a65cf66d_c.jpg

Generic vs Boots vs Lava (L to R below)

The generic one is fairly awful. Basic printed pattern, washed out red, shallow bevelling and a really thick black layer. The "Boots" one is a similar cod-celluloid pattern, but with a wide bevel and thin black layer. What's really nice is how it's been polished and the top edge rounded over just a fraction to make it feel old. Compared to the WD is looks fantastic, but the patterning is still a little bit meh. This is where Lava excels; the edges aren't as nicely finished as the Boots one but the celluloid itself is gorgeous - a real 3D effect to it and looks way closer to a proper original one.

I've also smoothed and yellowed those edges (thanks to an oak-tint furniture touch up pen!) and it's look fantastic.

You don't have to care, but the pics shows the difference nicely.

Lava on its own (before smoothing & yellowing)

Boots vs Lava (smoothed, no yellowing)

Boots vs Lava (smoothed and yellowed)

stickyfiddle · September 2023

What about Avantguard and Fender..?

Avantguard is another really great option, but I suspect a little more fragile. He only offers small guards these days, and admitted he had a hell of a time getting my P bass one to work without cracking. But they do look great and this edge finishing is phenomenal as well. A little more orange in tone than the Lava but just as lovely.

Fender is less than impressive imo. This is something I've honestly been baffled by over the last 10+ years. I get they don't want to spend big money on pick guards for regular production guitars, but surely the custom shop could do better?

The Jazz bass I have is great! Bit the guard sucks - it's honestly barely any better than the generic one I have above. I did have this replaced with a Lava one that worked way better, though I've taken it off as the bass is for sale.

Fender bass with Lava:

What about Spitfire? I don't have one. They're silly money and take months to arrive, but you do get to choose the colour and amount of pale speckling a bit more. Anyone got one?

stickyfiddle · September 2023

What I don't have any experience of is the stuff Gibson uses on the fancy guitars - ES-355 and so on. These always look good in pictures but I've never see them up close.

LionAquaLooper · September 2023

stickyfiddle said:

What about Avantguard and Fender..?

Avantguard is another really great option, but I suspect a little more fragile. He only offers small guards these days, and admitted he had a hell of a time getting my P bass one to work without cracking. But they do look great and this edge finishing is phenomenal as well. A little more orange in tone than the Lava but just as lovely.

Fender is less than impressive imo. This is something I've honestly been baffled by over the last 10+ years. I get they don't want to spend big money on pick guards for regular production guitars, but surely the custom shop could do better?

The Jazz bass I have is great! Bit the guard sucks - it's honestly barely any better than the generic one I have above. I did have this replaced with a Lava one that worked way better, though I've taken it off as the bass is for sale.

Fender bass with Lava:

What about Spitfire? I don't have one. They're silly money and take months to arrive, but you do get to choose the colour and amount of pale speckling a bit more. Anyone got one?

This is the colour I'm looking for to put in my 3-tone sunburst strat. It looks like midway between red tort and brown. I want one that looks like the one on Tom Misch's 3-tone burst strat. The red one I bought off eBay (cheapo one) is too red, and the brown one is definitely not it.

GoldenEraGuitars · September 2023

Is it worth throwing Reptile Pickguards into the mix?

GavRichList · September 2023

I’ve had spitfire in the past, and have a very early lava now (number 2 I believe, and it’s lightly reliced and warped). Lava looks LOADS better.

stickyfiddle · September 2023

GoldenEraGuitars said:

Is it worth throwing Reptile Pickguards into the mix?

Oh yes they look great. Has anyone got/had one?

koss59 · September 2023

Thanks for this, I’m after one for my old jazz bass.
Don’t suppose you’re selling the lava one you said you removed?

stickyfiddle · September 2023

koss59 said:

Thanks for this, I’m after one for my old jazz bass.
Don’t suppose you’re selling the lava one you said you removed?

I will be. Not sure when I'll next be in the UK but happy to hold it if useful. I have colleagues & friends coming in & out all the time and could post it

GoldenEraGuitars · September 2023

stickyfiddle said:

GoldenEraGuitars said:

Is it worth throwing Reptile Pickguards into the mix?

Oh yes they look great. Has anyone got/had one?

I may very well purchase one for a jazzmaster build of my own but I might buy a few as I plan to build a jag or JM for retail (ssshh, don’t tell anyone)

Seziertisch · September 2023

GoldenEraGuitars said:

Is it worth throwing Reptile Pickguards into the mix?

Pickford Guards in NI are also worth a look, he seems to specialise in doing 90s Japanese style guards with less yellow and orange than a traditional 60s would have.

GoldenEraGuitars · September 2023

Seziertisch said:

GoldenEraGuitars said:

Is it worth throwing Reptile Pickguards into the mix?

Pickford Guards in NI are also worth a look, he seems to specialise in doing 90s Japanese style guards with less yellow and orange than a traditional 60s would have.

Yes, I’ve seen. Although I do prefer the 60s ones (personal preference of course).

axisus · September 2023

The thing for me with tortoiseshell is that expensive ones look ace but cheap ones look horrible.

BillDL · September 2023

stickyfiddle said:
..............
I've also smoothed and yellowed those edges (thanks to an oak-tint furniture touch up pen!) and it's look fantastic.

I used some old Colron or Ronseal solvent based wood stain to darken a tortoiseshell scratchplate and "yellow" the white beveled edges, and it worked really well. I used one of the lighter of the natural wood stains like light oak or antique pine and experimented on white scratchplate material first. I realised that it actually ate into the plastic and stained it properly rather than just layering a colour on the surface. It was a case of wipe-on, wait a couple of minutes, then wipe-off and buff off any excess. I don't know that you can get that turpentine / white spirit based smelly stain/dye any more though, and alcohol based "spirit stains" don't eat into the plastic the same way.

stickyfiddle · September 2023

@BillDL that's a good call. I can get this stuff where I am. Not sure if that is quite the same thing - oil based?

https://www.aceuae.com/en-ae/minwax-wood-finish-penetrating-stain-946-ml-colonial-maple/133231.html

stickyfiddle · September 2023

These are the pens I have.

Cautions on the back mention “Contains Resin acids and Rosin acids, hydrogenated, esters with glycerol Fenuron, Hydrogen, propylamine. Harmful Vapors.”

So I think it’s the good stuff..!!

BillDL · September 2023

I'm not sure about the Minwax stuff. It sounds more like a Tung Oil or Danish Oil type of actual oil with a staining agent in it that soaks into the grain of wood and stays there to protect, rather than a stain from which the solvent evaporates. The reason I tried the solvent wood stain on the scratchplate was that I had previously dyed/stained a bare wood body with white binding and realised that the stain on the binding didn't rub off and I had to scrape it back to white. I also experimented with it to make a LP toggle switch cap look old, but it's harder plastic and the results weren't as predictable.

stickyfiddle · September 2023

BillDL said:

I'm not sure about the Minwax stuff. It sounds more like a Tung Oil or Danish Oil type of actual oil with a staining agent in it that soaks into the grain of wood, rather than a stain from which the solvent evaporates. The reason I tried the solvent wood stain on the scratchplate was that I had previously dyed/stained a bare wood body with white binding and realised that the stain on the binding didn't rub off and I had to scrape it back to white. I also experimented with it to make a LP toggle switch cap look old, but it's harder plastic and the results weren't as predictable.

I think you're probably right - this is far from my area of expertise. The pens smell great, which I assume means they've been banned in Europe...

barnstorm · September 2023

Wonder why tortoiseshell in the guitar world came to almost always mean the reddish colour and not the yellow/brown common in e.g. glasses frames. I prefer that look, but it's pretty uncommon even now with all the boutique builders around.

OilCityPickups · September 2023

Not really 'Tort' but this ... at least in person ... is one of the most beautiful scratch plate materials I have ever seen. The pattern looks so deep you feel you could reach into it!
Celluloid of course.

GavRichList · September 2023

Lava is pretty spot on I’d say.

stickyfiddle · September 2023

^^ Hubba. And indeed; hubba.

DefaultM · September 2023

Do Boots do theirs cheaper if you've got an Advantage Card?

stickyfiddle · September 2023

stickyfiddle said:

^^ Hubba. And indeed; hubba.

Typical that the one time I can't be arsed quoting properly it puts my post over the page..

bluecat · September 2023

They all look very nice, I just feel very sad for the tortoises.
My next pickguard will be stainless steel.

MikeBowes · September 2023

I'm a huge Spitfire tort fan!

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stickyfiddle · September 2023

@MikeBowes That's the stuff!! Can you get them any quicker than the rest of us mortals?

Seziertisch · September 2023

https://www.dropbox.com/s/b5jzqoqzi7dvep7/IMG_4276.JPG?raw=1

Hopefully the link works. A side by side between one from Earl Pilanz (off EBay) and Avantguard. My AG has less orange in it than the one posted above, I think.

GavRichList · September 2023

Seziertisch said:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/b5jzqoqzi7dvep7/IMG_4276.JPG?raw=1

Hopefully the link works. A side by side between one from Earl Pilanz (off EBay) and Avantguard. My AG has less orange in it than the one posted above, I think.

The AG looks Mike’s better.

I find spitfire guards a little bit too “extra”. Lava and avant are closer in aesthetic to the real thing I think. Even the price differences aside, I’d pick lava first, then avant, then spitfire. Don’t rate the Pickford ones - they look a bit like a nasty flesh wound.

stickyfiddle · September 2023

GavRichList said:

Seziertisch said:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/b5jzqoqzi7dvep7/IMG_4276.JPG?raw=1

Hopefully the link works. A side by side between one from Earl Pilanz (off EBay) and Avantguard. My AG has less orange in it than the one posted above, I think.

The AG looks Mike’s better.

I find spitfire guards a little bit too “extra”. Lava and avant are closer in aesthetic to the real thing I think. Even the price differences aside, I’d pick lava first, then avant, then spitfire. Don’t rate the Pickford ones - they look a bit like a nasty flesh wound.

I agree entirely with all this. Spitfires look great when a little more subtle but often go too far with the speckling. Arguably this is the buyers' fault as it's optional, but less is more, as usual

That AG is lovely. A little redder than mine but really nice.

GavRichList · September 2023

*miles. Fuck knows who Mike is.

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