Attenuator Help Please

Grampa · August 2023

I have a very simple rig....Tuner - Compressor - OD - Chorus - Reverb - 5W valve amp. I'm a home player and finding it very difficult to keep the volume low enough not to disturb the Mrs, but high enough to not sound like I'm playing unplugged with zero effects and always seem to be on the cusp of too loud, or nothing at all.
Is it possible to install a small passive variable attenuator between the amp head and speaker as a single point of output volume control? I'm hoping this may let get the full benefit of the effects but at a greatly reduced volume. (Speaker is a Celestion 8Ω)
If at all possible suggestions please.

marxski · August 2023

I have an Ironman II mini which works super well but was quite expensive.

One problem I find when playing quietly is you are getting a blend of guitar pick and acoustic noise of your electric blended with your ear hole. So never sounds right because of this.

munckee · August 2023

Everyone’s home volume is different. I use a Behringer attenuator with a Princeton and that sounds great at home volume but it’s not late night volume.

I have a THR which I can get good sounds out of at pretty much any volume. However when everyone is asleep I use boss waza air headphones.

Edit actually it’s a bugera attenuator. Dead simple bought it here used and it’s great piece of kit. Use it more than my pedal board

Grampa · August 2023

munckee said:

I have a THR which I can get good sounds out of at pretty much any volume.

Yes, I have a THR10 VII (original old style) that is pretty awesome which I either keep either in the office or use when not in the "music room". May have to resort to utilizing this when Grandma is watching TV or in bed and use the rig when she's not around.

Grampa · August 2023

marxski said:

I have an Ironman II mini which works super well but was quite expensive.

Just had a look at this on YT, not cheap but seems to do exactly what I want. Retiring on Friday so maybe a happy retirement day present to myself!

ICBM · August 2023

You don't need anything like that expensive for a 5W amp. A simple L-pad type attenuator will work fine if you can build one into a box yourself, or something like the Harley Benton one if you can't.

Grampa · August 2023

ICBM said:

You don't need anything like that expensive for a 5W amp. A simple L-pad type attenuator will work fine if you can build one into a box yourself, or something like the Harley Benton one if you can't.

Thank you, sounds like the answer, a little project for retirement

pt22 · August 2023

I think you’re on the cusp of benefitting from a headphone setup. Have you considered this?

It’s not going to be cheap if you want to run your amp in the signal chain, but there are a few “amp in a box” pedalboard headphone options you could consider that don’t break the bank.

I’ve used a Simplifier, a Victory pedalboard amp, and a CaptorX. All were excellent and made playing at low (no) volume a ton of fun.

Grampa · August 2023

@pt22 Considered and rejected. Thanks for the suggestion but just doesn't do it for me.

BowynMadley · August 2023

I've used a Swart nightlite junior with my tweed combo for ages. All passive with minimal tonal loss unless it's rolled right down

Winny_Pooh · August 2023

https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/227514/silverface-champ-l-pad-install#latest

LastMantra · August 2023

Will it make any difference to how loud you can play?

It's just going to be another volume control after the amp volume.

rze99 · August 2023

I've used attenuators since a studio engineer lent me one for a session with my Marshall stack . I've a collection of 11 amps a few are vintage valve amps and I use them live and in my home studio too - but all with attenuators.

I use THD Hotplates and Weber Mass and they all work well. I've bought all of them used and they haven't broken. You have to make sure that the maximum power of the attenuator is ample for your amps.

My hearing is excellent, my neighbours still talk to me and I'm still married. Thanks to attenuators!

pt22 · August 2023

LastMantra said:

Will it make any difference to how loud you can play?

It's just going to be another volume control after the amp volume.

This is a good question. If you cant play louder anyhow, another link in the chain isn't going to make much difference.

Re-reading your initial post @Grampa (gosh that sounds like I'm being very condescending! lol), are you looking for a bit more finesse in dialing in a low volume in general due to your amp being NMV, or are you looking to get a tone you like from pushing those 5 watts hard at a lower volume? You say you want full benefit of the effects, but I imagine the compressor and/or drive has a level control you can use to get the same type of overdrive at a lower volume level. What is your drive pedal?

I see you're in discussions on an expensive attenuator. That may help but may be overkill if you're just looking for another volume control.

EDIT

I see you may still have the 633 Dragonfly RT. That's already got a headroom control for drive at very low volumes. The X2 OD has a level control as well. I don't see what an attenuator is going to bring as a solution that would be worth that kind of money.

roberty · August 2023

Been using the Harley Benton one for about a year. I am shaving just a little off the top of my 30-50 watt non-master volume amps

I imagine it will be up to the task of taking your 5 watter down to domestic levels

Grampa · August 2023

@rze99 I like the look of the Weber Mass 100 but would this be overkill for a 5W 633 Dragonfly or do the job just the same as an amp with a higher output?

Grampa · August 2023

pt22 said:

LastMantra said:

Will it make any difference to how loud you can play?

It's just going to be another volume control after the amp volume.

This is a good question. If you cant play louder anyhow, another link in the chain isn't going to make much difference.

Re-reading your initial post @Grampa (gosh that sounds like I'm being very condescending! lol), are you looking for a bit more finesse in dialing in a low volume in general due to your amp being NMV, or are you looking to get a tone you like from pushing those 5 watts hard at a lower volume? You say you want full benefit of the effects, but I imagine the compressor and/or drive has a level control you can use to get the same type of overdrive at a lower volume level. What is your drive pedal?

I see you're in discussions on an expensive attenuator. That may help but may be overkill if you're just looking for another volume control.

Drive pedal is a Tim V3. The problem is that I have to set everything in the chain to such a low level to achieve the desired volume for home playing, a gnat's whisker above bugger all, that I'm right on the edge of might as well not bother plugging in. The THR10 achieves a very acceptable sound level while maintaining the dialled in effects, this is the sort of thing I'd like to achieve with my home rig. All the tone without the Grandma annoying volume.

ICBM · August 2023

Overkill, but there’s never any harm in that with an attenuator, other than cost and/or size. The power rating is simply the maximum it can take before it might be damaged.

And be careful with some, the ratings are optimistic - including Weber in my experience, but a 100W attenuator with anything less than a 50W amp should always be fine. The exception is those L-pads, which are usually called ‘100W’, but not suitable for any amp over 20W - the rating is based on their original application as treble attenuators for hi-fi speakers, where the 100W is the clean system power, not the power going to the speaker with an overdriven amp.

rze99 · August 2023

Grampa said:

@rze99 I like the look of the Weber Mass 100 but would this be overkill for a 5W 633 Dragonfly or do the job just the same as an amp with a higher output?

Overkill for a 5w they do 50w weighted one. I use the 100 for Marshall 50W stack and Fender Bassman level kit
There might be a an attenuator optimised for low watt amps but I don't know about that.

blacknblack · August 2023

ICBM said:

You don't need anything like that expensive for a 5W amp. A simple L-pad type attenuator will work fine if you can build one into a box yourself, or something like the Harley Benton one if you can't.

@ICBM apols stupid question … but is an L-pad attenuator something that goes between amp and cab? Not to confuse with a volume pot that can be put in say an effects loop. Thanks

pt22 · August 2023

Grampa said:

pt22 said:

LastMantra said:

Will it make any difference to how loud you can play?

It's just going to be another volume control after the amp volume.

This is a good question. If you cant play louder anyhow, another link in the chain isn't going to make much difference.

Re-reading your initial post @Grampa (gosh that sounds like I'm being very condescending! lol), are you looking for a bit more finesse in dialing in a low volume in general due to your amp being NMV, or are you looking to get a tone you like from pushing those 5 watts hard at a lower volume? You say you want full benefit of the effects, but I imagine the compressor and/or drive has a level control you can use to get the same type of overdrive at a lower volume level. What is your drive pedal?

I see you're in discussions on an expensive attenuator. That may help but may be overkill if you're just looking for another volume control.

Drive pedal is a Tim V3. The problem is that I have to set everything in the chain to such a low level to achieve the desired volume for home playing, a gnat's whisker above bugger all, that I'm right on the edge of might as well not bother plugging in. The THR10 achieves a very acceptable sound level while maintaining the dialled in effects, this is the sort of thing I'd like to achieve with my home rig. All the tone without the Grandma annoying volume.

I would still think there would be a way using the vol on your Tim and the power/volume knobs on the dragonfly to make everything work, especially if the Yammie does. I have both so I should have some shared experience. Hey, everyone's situation is different though.

I would look into a cheap Harley Benton attenuator or Bugera power soak. Passive and not a massive investment if you decide it doesn't do what you like.

ICBM · August 2023

blacknblack said:

is an L-pad attenuator something that goes between amp and cab? Not to confuse with a volume pot that can be put in say an effects loop.

Yes. They’re a type of variable power resistor (AKA ‘rheostat’) which presents a constant impedance to the amp, usually 8 ohms. They normally come as a separate component with no housing or connections, so if you don’t want to fit it into a cabinet you will need a box (preferably metal) and two jacks. If you’re running it with amp of more than about 10W I would make sure the box is either large or ventilated, or it will get quite hot. I wouldn’t risk it with more than a 20W amp at all, possibly not more than about 15W.

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