Three is company, foursomes are awesome

Tannin · March 2023

Some of us have a particular attachment to one maker.

@thomasross20 buys an extra Larrivee guitar every couple of months; @Cig35 has three Loef guitars; I have three Matons, @Mellish is a one-guitar-at-a-time man but he has owned quite a few Gibsons and several Martins at one time or another. @Cryptid is another Gibson man as is @jellyroll; @Gandalph loves Waterloo, @Kalimna and @PCT57 both love a Brook or three.

Who else likes one particular maker's guitars well enough to have three or more of them? (Or, if you stick to a more modest number of guitars in the house, to have owned three or more of the same make, just not all at the same time.)

Questions for you: what is it that makes this make stand out so clearly for you that you have three? Are you likely to get a fourth? Have you owned other examples of the make in the past? And do you also have guitars from other makers?

ToneControl · March 2023

Tannin said:

Some of us have a particular attachment to one maker.

@thomasross20 buys an extra Larrivee guitar every couple of months; @Cig35 has three Loef guitars; I have three Matons, @Mellish is a one-guitar-at-a-time man but he has owned quite a few Gibsons and several Martins at one time or another. @Cryptid is another Gibson man as is @jellyroll; @Gandalph loves Waterloo, @Kalimna and @PCT57 both love a Brook or three.

Who else likes one particular maker's guitars well enough to have three or more of them? (Or, if you stick to a more modest number of guitars in the house, to have owned three or more of the same make, just not all at the same time.)

Questions for you: what is it that makes this make stand out so clearly for you that you have three? Are you likely to get a fourth? Have you owned other examples of the make in the past? And do you also have guitars from other makers?

I used to have several Larrivees, for a while they were underpriced in the UK, and they are very well made
Then I moved onto smaller "boutique" brands:
Bourgeois (had 2, excellent but wrong woods/size for me), Goodall (have had 3, now have 2), Avalons (have quite a few)

I'd really like 2 or 3 Santa Cruz, but whenever I find one in the UK it's not my type, or too pricey: narrow nut, small body or mahogany (or overpriced). In the US, it would be a lot easier

stickyfiddle · March 2023

I would really like multiple Atkins and/or Bourgeoises (Bourgeoisie?) but that's gonna take some hefty saving...

thomasross20 · March 2023

I've had other makes. Avalon was great but neck was slightly too chunky. Larrivee , every one just feels and sounds right. I know and like the brand, value compared to a Martin and I still prefer the Larrivee. Interested in boutique but without trying, needs specific trip to try. I've found what I like and what works, priced ok and I know their models inside out. Can focus on playing and not gear hunting. It's like Christmas every time I can try one of their new models.

I also like the company ethos, affordable luxury. I actually like the company, the brand, the people I've spoken to. I'm a fanboy, hands up.

I do like the Celtic sound but I prefer a "modern traditional" which is what Larrivee gives. Not just trying to copy vintage sounds from ages ago. Honestly just love them.

I've tried some £10k+ that don't touch them, or if good, the incremental gains not worth it imo

thomasross20 · March 2023

At some point I think you have to stick to what you know and focus on the playing tbh

jellyroll · March 2023

Why do I have multiple Gibsons? Good question. Its kind of extravagant and feels somewhat temporary....but I really would/will struggle to know which one(s) to sell. I buy them out of curiosity and a sense of experimentation. I currently have three Historics...a Banner Southern Jumbo (basically a Rosewood J45); a J-35; and an Advanced Jumbo (long scale, Rosewood).

The AJ probably suits me least as it feels like its more for textured slow playing, while the SJ and J-35 suit my heavy handed playing better.

I can't really articulate what it is that draws me to the Gibsons. Perhaps, something about their attack/decay and their playability. They just feel like "home" compared to the very nice Martins and Collings I have.

The Gibson I sold was a Historic J-185. As much as I wanted to, I just couldn't get on with it....sounded mushy.

In my head, Gibsons really do have their own thing going on which I haven't found in any other brand, even in guitars which aim to copy specific Gibson models. I think of them a little like certain Alfa Romeos. If you iron out their "imperfections" they lose their uniqueness.

Cryptid · March 2023

I've been through a fair few acoustics over the last ten years looking for the ultimate rhythm machine for live work and recording. Most of the time it's strumming with a pick and a lot of snappy, syncopated stuff. I like maple due to the quick attack and decay and emphasis on the fundamental. I've found large maple Gibsons in particular have 'it' for me - growl, thump and a dry midrange that suits the material I play and is easy to mix live and in the studio.

I thought my maple SJ-200 was the ultimate box for this purpose, until I tried the Bozeman-made Epiphone Frontier. Everything I need from the SJ-200 but lighter built and more responsive and dynamic - sounds great fingerpicked, single note runs sound fuller and the strummed growl has a wonderful creamy quality to it. Spec-wise it's basically a Dove with a hog neck and different bridge, and for me, preferable aesthetics.

So, once I sell my SJ-200 I'll no longer have anything with Gibson on the headstock. Although the Epi is really a Gibson

My only other acoustic is a luthier-built 000 size guitar, mahogany B&S with a wide neck and Spanish heel. Not played anything I prefer more for fingerpicking.

I need a beater for camping and gardens etc, and it's looking like that'll probably be a Vintage V300MH

Kalimna · March 2023

As mentioned, I have a pair of Brooks, each with some very personalised adornments I like the folk at Brook, I like the way they use as much local timber as possible, and I like the impossible roads leading to their workshop. The fact that they also play and sound phenomenal helps

In addition to Brook, I suppose I do have 'brand loyalty' - I picked up my second PJEggle at the Birmingham show (metallic green Macon Jnr) and genuinely feel they have the best (for my hands) playing necks out there (including a few other UK builders). Im also lucky enough to count a pair of 633 amps and 3 (soon to be completed 4) Modulus Amp kits.

Im very lucky with the gear I have.

ESBlonde · March 2023

thomasross20 said:

At some point I think you have to stick to what you know and focus on the playing tbh

This resonates (?) with me, I find it hard to sell things on when Ive found something I liked, and yes I’m surrounded by “stuff”.

Once I’ve bonded with a guitar that’s it, I’ve been lucky in later life to accumulate some tasty gear but in the past I’ve sold some stuff to feed the family so I understand.

Mellish · March 2023

@Tannin ; I've had either Gibson or Martin from around 1975 to present. Some I've had to move on cos they weren't as good as I thought, some I've sold to raise quick cash, but most I kept until I got that urge for something new.

I'm only allowed to own one-at-a-time. Mrs M puts it this way "Why do you want two when you can't even play one?!"......

But you could put the finest Atkin, Brook, Avalon, Fylde in my hands and (excellent though they are) I'm so used to Gibson and Martin that nothing else feels right for me.

MSedg · March 2023

I’ve had 5 Atkins - sadly I don’t still have them all (my wife does have a lot of patience but even she has limits). I’m now down to two, an OM (adi top, ebony b/s) and a 00 (all mahogany). Previously I’ve had a 000 12 fretter, a rosewood dread and their take on an L-00 (maple b/s).

I’ve had others of the big brands but for me there’s just something that works about them - I’m a big fan of the relic work (perhaps except for the tuners, which always look wrong), they sound very “open” from the get-go, and they seem pretty consistently excellent (with perhaps a couple of exceptions of probably 30 or so I’ve played. These two have lasted the longest and complement each other - for the moment at least my acoustic buying has ended (back to electric….)

stickyfiddle · March 2023

@MSedg Is your OM the black-topped one Coda had in a year or so ago, dubbed "Raven" or some such? Absolutely gorgeous thing if so - I very nearly bought it myself! Do let me know if you ever want to move it on...

Tannin · March 2023

So many insightful comments. Great stuff @Fretboarders. ;;

Like most Australians, I grew up hearing Matons on the radio and on records and in live performances. Is that why they resonate with me? Perhaps, but I don't think that's the whole answer. More to the point (and I'm echoing @Mellish here, at least a bit) is that the first really good guitars I played were Matons, and the first really good guitar I owned was a Maton. That was 1980-something and I've had any number of other guitars since and liked most of them but that Maton sound and feel will always be "home base". Ove the years I've bought five, currently own three, and fully intend to buy one more - but not this year. I'm rationing myself to one new guitar per year. In 2023 it's a custom-made baritone (on order since 2021), next year a Brook, so it's 2025 for the next Maton. I know exactly what I want and I'll order it fairly soon so as to be sure of getting it before head luthier Andy Allen retires.)

There are other things I like about them. They use a lot of sustainable local timbers (a huge plus in my book), I've never yet seen a real-life quality control issue, and here in Oz they are very reasonably priced (it is actually quite difficult to justify buying (e.g.) a Martin or a Taylor here as for any given budget you can always buy a Maton that is a full quality step up, if not two). Sadly, they are very dear in the UK. OK, everything is dear in the UK because of that savage 20% VAT, but someone is making a huge margin on them.

Will I buy more after the next one? Perhaps not. Four should be enough. I'll go on buying nice guitars, one a year, until I run out of money or fall off the perch. But I can think of half a dozen other lovely instruments to fall in love with: something German (a Stoll most likely, possibly a Cuntz or a Lakewood), something Japanese (Yairi?), one or two classic Americans (Huss and Dalton, Collings, Martin) .....

Hell, I'm not guitarist enough to justify even one of the various lovely instruments I own, never mind the others I have my eye on. But I worked hard for all those years, I have no kids, the house is paid for, and no-one lives forever. Why not have some fun?

roberty · March 2023

I have four Gibsons, four Fenders and four Reverends. All a bit silly really. One of the Fenders is a bass, in my defence

MSedg · March 2023

stickyfiddle said:

@MSedg Is your OM the black-topped one Coda had in a year or so ago, dubbed "Raven" or some such? Absolutely gorgeous thing if so - I very nearly bought it myself! Do let me know if you ever want to move it on...

It is indeed, you’ve clearly got excellent taste

But it’s going nowhere I’m afraid, it’s a pretty rare occurrence to own the best guitar you’ve ever played - and I think my wife would kill me if I flogged it. It’s the only guitar I’ve ever played that she’s pretty much forced me to buy, I really only went in to gawp at that gold-top L-00 they got at the same time…

stickyfiddle · March 2023

MSedg said:

stickyfiddle said:

@MSedg Is your OM the black-topped one Coda had in a year or so ago, dubbed "Raven" or some such? Absolutely gorgeous thing if so - I very nearly bought it myself! Do let me know if you ever want to move it on...

It is indeed, you’ve clearly got excellent taste But it’s going nowhere I’m afraid, it’s a pretty rare occurrence to own the best guitar you’ve ever played - and I think my wife would kill me if I flogged it. It’s the only guitar I’ve ever played that she’s pretty much forced me to buy, I really only went in to gawp at that gold-top L-00 they got at the same time…

Excellent and I'm very glad to hear it.

But I'm here if you ever change your mind

GTC · March 2023

Kalimna said:

As mentioned, I have a pair of Brooks, each with some very personalised adornments I like the folk at Brook, I like the way they use as much local timber as possible, and I like the impossible roads leading to their workshop. The fact that they also play and sound phenomenal helps

In addition to Brook, I suppose I do have 'brand loyalty' - I picked up my second PJEggle at the Birmingham show (metallic green Macon Jnr) and genuinely feel they have the best (for my hands) playing necks out there (including a few other UK builders). Im also lucky enough to count a pair of 633 amps and 3 (soon to be completed 4) Modulus Amp kits.

Im very lucky with the gear I have.

I don't really have any brand loyalty - but, if I ever I wanted a special custom build, my first thought would be for Brook. Not just because of their wonderful instruments and skills - but for the overall buying experience. They are such nice people and a trip down there is always special.

Just to be controversial - I've never come across a Taylor or Martin (and I've had a few) that I would rate any better than just competent.

I really wanted to like Lowden - but, again after trying a few, they just don't do it for me. Not so with my Redwood / Oak Avalon though.

I've never tried a Larrivee - but after @thomasross20 waxing lyrical about them, I occasionally find myself drawn to the P-03 lefty they've got for sale at the Knighton Music Centre.

Finally, if I wanted something really different and non-mainstream I wouldn't hesitate to go to Alan Miller (Glastonbury). Terrific bloke, lovely instruments. He's currently redesigning the sub-bass arm of the harp guitar I recently bought from him to accommodate the strings in the more usual sequence.

Like Kalimna - I'm also very lucky to have the gear I have along with the flexibility and freedom to experiment.

thomasross20 · March 2023

I'd try Brook if lived closer.

@GTC have you tried the P-03?

Matin, is it a maple B&S Tommy Emmanuel uses? Sounds fantastic

It's a good thing there's choice in the world

GTC · March 2023

thomasross20 said:

I'd try Brook if lived closer.

@GTC have you tried the P-03?

Matin, is it a maple B&S Tommy Emmanuel uses? Sounds fantastic

It's a good thing there's choice in the world

I haven't yet tried the P-03. I guess by mentioning it here I secretly hope someone else might buy it to remove temptation

thomasross20 · March 2023

Haha I'd defo try it first as you don't get much bass out obvs (boutique builders' Parlours can do but you're looking at big £££ imo) but I love the sound and it makes me want to pick up and play

malcolmkindness · March 2023

thomasross20 said:

At some point I think you have to stick to what you know and focus on the playing tbh

Very wise advice.

guitarjack66 · March 2023

I'd love to find an affordable brand of value for money instruments. Yamaha would probably be the best but I dont get on with their necks and their prices have risen quite sharply in the budget market of late.

Cig35 · March 2023

Why do I have three Loef guitars, a really unknown brand?

The first one i bought was really a coincidence, I followed a link to a youtube guitarist posted on this site and noticed he was playing a Loef, Then googled a bit and found some other professionals using them and looked at Loef guitars website and saw he had one for sale. Since I was thinking about buying a hand-built guitar at that time I sent a message and asked if it was still available. When I got a positive answer and he offered a discount I decided to go for it. I was quite nervous buying blind but when it arrived I was really impressed with the look and the sound and playing the guitar it just felt "right" from the first moment I touched it.

From there it just continued and I've been equally impressed with the other two also, and consider his prices as competitive for a one-man luthier guitar, even if that doesn't mean cheap.

@Tannin I recently found out a Loef guitar is moving from the US to Australia when Olav published the message he got from the new owner on Facebook:

“Hello mate. My name is Craig. I have been a full time musician for the past 25 years. I am Australian but am visiting the USA for a couple of weeks. I’ve come across one of your guitars - the Stani - for sale in the States. I LOVE it. Today I played everything from a 1920‘s Gibsons up and even though I had no idea about your guitars it screamed “I’m the one”. It had no name on the headstock I’d heard of but it was clearly head and shoulders over anything else I’d played. Just wondering if you can tell me anything about this guitar. I will include a screen shot of its details. Sincere congratulations on creating amazing sounding instruments. Thank you very much, Craig Stewart”

So I'm not the only one appreciating them.

Will I buy a fourth one from him? Probably yes

Will I buy an acoustic of another brand? Most certainly yes

Tannin · March 2023

thomasross20 said:

Matin, is it a maple B&S Tommy Emmanuel uses? Sounds fantastic

It's a good thing there's choice in the world

Queensland Maple, @thomasross20, which (confusingly) is nothing at all to do with maple. Queensland Maple is a Flindersia, The Flindersia genus is native to Australia and some nearby islands; all except one of the 15 or so species grow in rainforests. The family Flindersia belongs to also includes the genus Citrus (oranges, lemons and similar), the curry leaf tree that is so central to Indian and Sri Lankan cuisine, and others. The mahogany family is distantly related.

Queensland Maple is the most neutral and versatile of tonewoods; I like to describe it as the timber equivalent of a plain white shirt - looks good anywhere, be that the beach, a party, the office, a wedding, or a funeral. Between them, Queensland Maple and Blackwood provide the vast majority of backs, sides, and necks for Australian guitars. One of my Matons is Queensland Maple, my Cole Clark is Silky Maple, another Flindersia species with a silly name.

Tommy's guitar uses Queensland Maple for back and sides. You can buy the exact same guitar here - https://www.projectmusic.net/maton-te-personal-21694-p.asp or a very similar but factory made equivalent here: https://www.projectmusic.net/maton-ebg-808-te-tommy-emmanuel-guitar-21301-p.asp I've played both models; I very nearly bought the factory one a couple of times in 2020 (but ended up with a Cole Clark and a different Maton), and the hand-made TE Personal in 2021. (It was a toss-up between that and the Maton WA May I ended up with.)

In an earlier post, I mentioned that I have an eye on a Maton for my 2024 guitar - that will be a modified TE Personal, keeping the Queensland Maple back and sides but swapping the other timbers over to make it 100% local. Oh, and doing something about that headstock. (Sorry Tommy, love your playing but the kangaroo headstock is awfully kitsch.)

thomasross20 · March 2023

I need to try one of those Matons.

I see they have one relatively near me.

I wasn't aware Queensland maple was so close to mahogany (which I love). This could get interesting lol

Tannin · March 2023

Distantly related, @thomasross20.:)

Different family, same order. To put that into context, your cat (if you have one) is in the same family as (for example) a Leopard or a Tiger, and in a different family but the same order as dogs and foxes, ferrets, bears, and seals.

Gandalph · March 2023

Ha yes I'm certainly a fan of the Waterloo line although ironically I don't currently own one.

Right now I'm enjoying 2 Martins and a Gibson with an Iris on the way.

I've had the Wl-14, WL-14 hog, WLK and Jumbo King. Would love to get my hands on a WLS delux.
All 1 3/4" nut, 2 3/8" spacing - perfect! They all had that dry woody old time sound.
The Jumbo King sounded huge but was also too huge (for me) to handle comfortably. Fantastic big old V neck that carried tone for ages.
The WLK was light as a feather, very responsive. Maybe too responsive and too light, always felt like I was going to break it.

The hog WL-14 had the old sound, strong snappy base but sounded a bit thin and weak in the mids/trebles. Not enough meat on its bones.

The WL-14 was the pick of the bunch. More attitude and depth than the hog version.

Tannin · March 2023

As you know, I have 3 Matons and some other guitars. The chap over the road has had a Maton for ages and last year added a nice Martin. We play each-other's guitars every so often, which is fun.

Now we have new next-door neighbours. I'm away on the big island for a month but Mrs Tannin (who is still at home) invited them in for a cuppa today. "Oh" says new neighbour, "you like guitars, I see. Oh, Matons., that's interesting." It turns out that the new neighbour has an old one (Mrs Tannin thought he said 1948!) which he picked up for next to nothing at a garage sale. Would I be interested when I get back?

Does a dog have fleas?

I'm guessing it will be an archtop, probably in need of some TLC. Can't wait to have a look at it!

deejayen · March 2023

Tannin said:

Would I be interested when I get back?

Does a dog have fleas?

No doubt you're already on your way!

I just hope your other neighbour doesn't hear about it before you make it back!

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Three is company, foursomes are awesome

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