WTB Kiesel/Carvin Allan Holdsworth HH1 or HH2

Rocky1991 · February 2023

Hello friends,

Are there any out there? Was offered one not so long back but did not fancy it at the time. But they have grown on me.

thanks

carlos · February 2023

Not sure this will be helpful, but I've played both the HH and the Vader and they're very similar. Granted, the Vader was one with the thicker neck option. Still, I'd consider this one which is at an incredibly cheap price right now (no affiliation) - https://reverb.com/uk/item/65600962-kiesel-carvin-vader-6-2015-walnut

You could then replace the Lithium pickups w/ Holdsworths and you won't be a million miles away IMO.

wizbit81 · February 2023

HH and Vader are really quite different for me. I have owned 2 of the HH's for years and owned a Vader for about 2 weeks before I decided to shift it.
Vader tuners/trem bang into your leg and push the guitar out of tune.
Vader is not well balanced compared to the Holdsworth models.
Holdsworth's come with 20" radius as standard and a particular neck carve. My Vader was 12" from memory and a neck like a bat which I didn't like (although different ones will have different options). Holdsworths are usually chambered, the Vader isn't.
That's my thoughts on the matter anyhow.
Imo.....get a Holdsworth if you can find one.

carlos · February 2023

wizbit81 said:

Vader tuners/trem bang into your leg and push the guitar out of tune.
Vader is not well balanced compared to the Holdsworth models.

You're not supposed to rest it on your leg like a V. Vader has a shape like a normal doublecut guitar. You rest it on its side when playing sitting down. What the hell were you doing with it? Are you sure you're not mistaking it for another shape?

Holdsworth's come with 20" radius as standard and a particular neck carve. My Vader was 12" from memory and a neck like a bat which I didn't like (although different ones will have different options). Holdsworths are usually chambered, the Vader isn't.

So does the Vader. What sort of rubbish are you talking, man? Vaders come 20" as standard, 14" as an option. Both guitars have the same neck thickness.

From their website:

Vader - 1.69" Wide @ Nut, 0.76" Thick @ 1st Fret, 0.88" Thick @ 12th Fret
Holdsworth - 1.69" Wide @ Nut, 0.76" Thick @ 1st Fret, 0.88" Thick @ 12th Fret

For god's sake please do a couple of minutes of Googling before spreading misinformation.

wizbit81 · February 2023

@carlos ;

Pipe down if you can't be polite, if you want to pick an argument then fine, DM me don't do it on this thread.

I'm a left leg player, classical position. The tuners/trem hit the right leg and knock it out of tune, usually a fair amount sharp. It doesn't happen with the Holdsworths, it's the poor design of the Vader that causes it, and it's insurmountable if you play like that. If you'd owned them both and were a left leg player you'd know. You haven't or you aren't, so you don't know, end of.

The ones I have absolutely do not have the same neck thickness as the Vader I owned.....where did you fail to read that I've had two HH for years and I owned a Vader. One of my HH is the 'thinner' neck profile and the other is standard. Neither is anything like the Vader I had which I really did not like tbh. Not 'played both' not 'once sniffed one in a bar' I have owned these and I know the feel and shape of my Holdsworths extremely well. The Vader I had was way different and I didn't like it at all, which was such a disappointment. Mine might have been a different custom order as Kiesel is effectively a custom shop and all the guitars are different, and I guess these could have changed over the years as this was a 1st year model, but it was very different, in a negative way. Notice I said 'for me' and talked about my personal experience and opinion, I didn't make a subjective declaration about all Vaders apart from on the chambering, balance, and design re: going of of tune if you're a left leg player.

Apologies to OP for continuing on this thread. I won't reply on here again if there's another comment about this.

Again, Carlos, just watch how you talk to people please.

carlos · February 2023

I'm a left leg player, too, and I can get a normal angle on the Vader while not resting it on the tuners. Then again, we each have our own legs.

Rocky1991 · February 2023

Thanks for the feedback guys, hopefully one will surface. I will have a look at the vadar

Rocky1991 · February 2023

Bump fingers crossed

Gizmo · February 2023

@yuri_1973 had one for sale over at SS.org

https://www.sevenstring.org/threads/eu-kiesel-holdsworth-ferrari-red-tremolo-1630-€-shipped-eu.358715/

But seems it went earlyer this year by the looks of it, that said might be worth seeing if the buyer of that guitar bonded with it or is looking to move it on (we all know how sometime the things we lust after don't turn out to be what we thought they might be...)

I'll keep an eye out and GL with the search....

yuri_1973 · February 2023

Yes, mine was sold months ago.
I kept a headless Kiesel Leia, which was more versatile with 2 humbuckers than the single hum Holdsworth I had.
I still have the Leia, phenomenal piece, but wouldn't mind selling it tbh

Rocky1991 · February 2023

Gizmo said:

@yuri_1973 had one for sale over at SS.org

https://www.sevenstring.org/threads/eu-kiesel-holdsworth-ferrari-red-tremolo-1630-€-shipped-eu.358715/

But seems it went earlyer this year by the looks of it, that said might be worth seeing if the buyer of that guitar bonded with it or is looking to move it on (we all know how sometime the things we lust after don't turn out to be what we thought they might be...)

I'll keep an eye out and GL with the search....

Thanks gizmo!

That is the one I got offered and declined but then grew on me!

Rocky1991 · February 2023

yuri_1973 said:

Yes, mine was sold months ago.
I kept a headless Kiesel Leia, which was more versatile with 2 humbuckers than the single hum Holdsworth I had.
I still have the Leia, phenomenal piece, but wouldn't mind selling it tbh

Should have bought it when you offered me it!

Rocky1991 · February 2023

Last bump

guitarmangler · February 2023

Not a Kiesel, but similar specs on this strandberg
https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/243282/fs-strandberg-boden-masvidalien-ebony-fretboard#latest

Rocky1991 · February 2023

guitarmangler said:

Not a Kiesel, but similar specs on this strandberg
https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/243282/fs-strandberg-boden-masvidalien-ebony-fretboard#latest

Thanks for the link, very nice. Not sure if the pickup would be a lil high gain for me but looks like a lovely guitar!

guitarmangler · February 2023

Rocky1991 said:

guitarmangler said:

Not a Kiesel, but similar specs on this strandberg
https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/243282/fs-strandberg-boden-masvidalien-ebony-fretboard#latest

Thanks for the link, very nice. Not sure if the pickup would be a lil high gain for me but looks like a lovely guitar!

I’ve got 2 Kiesel Holdsworth’s and a similarly spec’d Vader and had a strandberg. They’re surprisingly similar, 20” radius chunky feeling neck, jumbo frets, headless etc. Ola strandberg originally started making guitars, headless in particular, because of Holdsworth. He also made Holdsworth a custom one pickup guitar. Strandberg’s will get you 85% there. The only thing missing is being able to prop it up without the guitar falling over and the hexagonal neck.
Buying kiesels second hand can be a bit of a minefield, as you can spec them very differently, and Kiesel themselves don’t keep the spec or are un interested in telling you it. A holdsworth spec Kiesel from their website is now $2600! They charge you $100 to delete the neck pickup !

carlos · March 2023

A Holdsworth has appeared in stock in their website today (yes, I check it every day!).
https://www.kieselguitars.com/in-stock/161998

Rocky1991 · March 2023

carlos said:

A Holdsworth has appeared in stock in their website today (yes, I check it every day!).
https://www.kieselguitars.com/in-stock/161998

Thanks Carlos,

Sent them an email as the specs sheet does not match the picture. See what happens!

Thanks for keeping me in mind!

carlos · March 2023

Good luck, I'm rooting for you

Rocky1991 · March 2023

Try again.

A guy in New york won't sell me his

carlos · March 2023

New one available - https://www.kieselguitars.com/in-stock/161967

Disgusting 12" radius, though! But very classy finish.

guitarmangler · March 2023

There’s a Delap style copy at strung out guitars
https://strungoutguitars.com/shop/lever-billy-delap-style-headless-guitar-made-in-england-2019/

wizbit81 · March 2023

That's been doing the rounds for a few years now. Nobody hangs onto it for very long it seems. He's put his own slight tweak on the Delap design by changing the horns and proportions a bit, the chambering will not be what Bill does with his twin beam suspension thing, frets are Medium vs 6100 on Delaps etc etc.
Interesting thing though. BTW I've seen that go for a LOT less before. No idea where they are getting 2k used from for it.

guitarmangler · March 2023

I do vaguely remember it being on eBay? If it’s the wrong specs, then it it too much. Probably too much, regardless.

carlos · March 2023

Price seems ambitious for a guitar from an unknown maker.

Gizmo · June 2023

Rocky1991 said:

Hello friends,

Are there any out there? Was offered one not so long back but did not fancy it at the time. But they have grown on me.

thanks

Not mine but If your still looking?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/115841269967?hash=item1af8ad80cf:g:vRkAAOSwN6xkdQKv

Rocky1991 · June 2023

Thanks Gizmo, I managed to get a Kiesel HH2 in the end a few months back. Actually toying with the idea of selling it to buy something 335ie.

wizbit81 · June 2023

If you're thinking of selling ping me a pic or two. I'm always interested in those

NoNotNow · September 2023

wizbit81 said:

If you're thinking of selling ping me a pic or two. I'm always interested in those

If still interested this one looks unbelievable clean.
Carvin HH2 Allan Holdsworth Signature White - Some Neck Guitars

carlos · September 2023

NoNotNow said:

wizbit81 said:

If you're thinking of selling ping me a pic or two. I'm always interested in those

If still interested this one looks unbelievable clean.
Carvin HH2 Allan Holdsworth Signature White - Some Neck Guitars

Went for £890 last week. Unbelievable markup
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/155766924688?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=wQjeSudBTJ2&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=2uBOvR_lSKK&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

wizbit81 · September 2023

Yeah I saw that. Passed at 890 just because I have teo others that are nicer. Would be nice if it had gone to someone who was going to use it instead of a price doubling flipper.

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WTB Kiesel/Carvin Allan Holdsworth HH1 or HH2

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