Cheap parlours: are Fender & Gretsch any good

Yorkie · December 2022

My Yamaha electroacoustic dreadnought is too big for me. It’s only taken me >20 years to realise, but I’ve got there in the end. I need something smaller. I play and record blues (90% of time it’s clean, the other 10% through a Blues Driver). So I thought a parlour would be a good fit. I am fine with a purely acoustic model, and can’t spend more than £200 at this point anyway.

Are the Fender and Gretsch (Jim Dandy or something like that) models any good at that sub-200 price point?

Many thanks,
Jon

BillDL · December 2022

I have a Fender Fender CP-60S Parlour Guitar in sunburst. (my NGD thread for it) It cost £158 from Gear4Music in June this year. It's not a whole lot shorter than a standard acoustic given that the 20 fret neck (24.75" scale) joins the body at the 14th fret rather than the more traditional 12th fret, but the body is nice and small so it's pretty easy to lie back on the couch and pick or strum, which is the reason I bought it. The top is solid spruce and the body and sides are laminated mahogany. The fretboard and bridge are walnut, and the fretboard feels pretty comfortable after the very slightly rough fret ends were filed smooth. 42.9mm plastic nut and dual-action truss rod. The tuning gears aren't the greatest quality, but they work OK and hold tune once you get there.

It is very well made and finished for the money and feels good to play. It is slightly "boxy" in tone, as can usually be expected for the reduced body volume and soundboard area, but is surprisingly loud. One thing that improved the sound noticeably was peeling off the cheap plastic scratchplate.

I don't think the CP-60S is available with a piezo pickup, but I didn't want or need one. As an easy to play, more portable acoustic guitar for spare time strumming and picking for my own entertainment on the couch it does me fine, but if I was looking for a more serious parlour sized guitar to record or perform with I would be inclined to go for a more expensive and (probably) better one above the £200 level.

Yorkie · December 2022

BillDL said:

I have a Fender Fender CP-60S Parlour Guitar in sunburst. (my NGD thread for it) It cost £158 from Gear4Music in June this year. It's not a whole lot shorter than a standard acoustic given that the 20 fret neck (24.75" scale) joins the body at the 14th fret rather than the more traditional 12th fret, but the body is nice and small so it's pretty easy to lie back on the couch and pick or strum, which is the reason I bought it. The top is solid spruce and the body and sides are laminated mahogany. The fretboard and bridge are walnut, and the fretboard feels pretty comfortable after the very slightly rough fret ends were filed smooth. 42.9mm plastic nut and dual-action truss rod. The tuning gears aren't the greatest quality, but they work OK and hold tune once you get there.

It is very well made and finished for the money and feels good to play. It is slightly "boxy" in tone, as can usually be expected for the reduced body volume and soundboard area, but is surprisingly loud. One thing that improved the sound noticeably was peeling off the cheap plastic scratchplate.

I don't think the CP-60S is available with a piezo pickup, but I didn't want or need one. As an easy to play, more portable acoustic guitar for spare time strumming and picking for my own entertainment on the couch it does me fine, but if I was looking for a more serious parlour sized guitar to record or perform with I would be inclined to go for a more expensive and (probably) better one above the £200 level.

Thanks! I wouldn’t mind spending £200 or more to buy something better second hand, but I haven’t found anything suitable. Will have a look at your NGD thread in a minute.

Dave_Mc · December 2022

If you don't mind spending a bit more, you can get Fender Paramount and Recording King (the memorably-named RPS-11-FE3-TBR) all-solid parlours for £300-£350 (new). I haven't tried them, just to be clear- but they might be worth considering. EDIT: oh or there's a Harley Benton all-solid one for around £200 as well- again, I haven't tried it.

Kittyfrisk · December 2022

Cracked record time

Try out a Vintage V300MH if you can, as well as the recommended guitars above.
https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/227138/nagd-vintage-v300mh/p1

Dave_Mc · December 2022

Kittyfrisk said:

Cracked record time Try out a Vintage V300MH if you can, as well as the recommended guitars above.
https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/227138/nagd-vintage-v300mh/p1

That's a good call actually. I think I have tried that one (several years ago) or at least something very similar (i.e. still a Vintage at a similar price/spec), and it was very nice indeed!

Kilgore · December 2022

You could have a look at Baton Rouge parlours.

Caveat: I know nothing about them, I just recently stumbled across them on YouTube.

drofluf · December 2022

Nothing wrong with parlours but you may not need to go all the way down, sizewise. Like you I find Dread’s uncomfortable and am much happier with smaller guitars; for me the “sweet spot” is probably a 00.

But I’d endorse the recommendation for Vintage as a brand, I’ve got the Paul Brett signature 12 string and it’s a great guitar. And yes it is a parlour

but my main guitar is a 00.

guitarjack66 · December 2022

Kittyfrisk said:

Cracked record time Try out a Vintage V300MH if you can, as well as the recommended guitars above.
https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/227138/nagd-vintage-v300mh/p1

I have been looking at these for ages but the narrow fretboard is a killer for me.

paulnb57 · December 2022

I have a Jim Dandy, I like it, I suppose they have their own sound, but are a great blueser

Yorkie · December 2022

Thanks everyone for your suggestions. Always a pleasure to ask questions here.

Kittyfrisk said:

Cracked record time

I pulled an inverse Brian May manoeuvre. I bought the guitar and started a PhD at the same time, but my research career took off almost immediately and so for the past ~25 years the guitar was sitting in a corner in every house, every country and every continent I've worked in. And now I can finally play, I'm getting 25 year-old buyer's remorse. Mental, I know.

Jon

Kittyfrisk · December 2022

^ Thankfully, there are no rules to owning guitars. Just do it your own way in your own time, that's the right way for you

Jez6345789 · December 2022

As. A Blues tool my gin Ricky has turned out to be hard to beat. It has that old school blues sound then plu it in with some drive it’s a nice for blues slide, takes tunings fine and had mine coming on 3 years and use it a lot.

Kilgore · December 2022

Yorkie said:

I pulled an inverse Brian May manoeuvre. I bought the guitar and started a PhD at the same time, but my research career took off almost immediately and so for the past ~25 years the guitar was sitting in a corner in every house, every country and every continent I've worked in. And now I can finally play, I'm getting 25 year-old buyer's remorse. Mental, I know.

Jon

Take your time choosing a new guitar. Don't be badgered into a decision you might regret.

guitarjack66 · December 2022

Kilgore said:

Yorkie said:

I pulled an inverse Brian May manoeuvre. I bought the guitar and started a PhD at the same time, but my research career took off almost immediately and so for the past ~25 years the guitar was sitting in a corner in every house, every country and every continent I've worked in. And now I can finally play, I'm getting 25 year-old buyer's remorse. Mental, I know.

Jon

Take your time choosing a new guitar. Don't be badgered into a decision you might regret.

On previous experience patience is something he definitely has!

sir_strumalot · December 2022

Yorkie said:

Thanks everyone for your suggestions. Always a pleasure to ask questions here.

Kittyfrisk said:

Cracked record time

I pulled an inverse Brian May manoeuvre. I bought the guitar and started a PhD at the same time, but my research career took off almost immediately and so for the past ~25 years the guitar was sitting in a corner in every house, every country and every continent I've worked in. And now I can finally play, I'm getting 25 year-old buyer's remorse. Mental, I know.

Jon

Glad to hear you have put your mis-spent youth in research behind you and come back to the guitar.

I was tempted by this from thomann, although I ended up buying something more expensive:

https://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_clf_200_wn.htm

bertie · December 2022

V300 is good call for trying a smaller bodied guitar (but no down to parlor size) at a great ££ point - personally not a fan of all mahogany not spanky enough the "warmness" is a bit dull/lifeless for me - but they do a spruce top one.

I would definitely try some smaller bodied guitars before you buy, not all are made or sound equal and can vary massively in tone. You may not like what you hear so dont play just one

MartinBush · December 2022

I tried a Gretsch Jim Dandy at PMT. It felt and sounded poor to me.

It was worth going in store to try a few as I'd been interested in the Gretsch for a long time - in the end I played various acoustics and came away with a Yamaha.

Kilgore · December 2022

MartinBush said:

I tried a Gretsch Jim Dandy at PMT. It felt and sounded poor to me.

It was worth going in store to try a few as I'd been interested in the Gretsch for a long time - in the end I played various acoustics and came away with a Yamaha.

They're very much a one trick pony. I think they sound OK for that rustic country blues vibe but not much else.

Clecko · December 2022

bertie said:

V300 is good call for trying a smaller bodied guitar (but no down to parlor size) at a great ££ point - personally not a fan of all mahogany not spanky enough the "warmness" is a bit dull/lifeless for me - but they do a spruce top one.

I would definitely try some smaller bodied guitars before you buy, not all are made or sound equal and can vary massively in tone. You may not like what you hear so dont play just one

Totally agree with this. I've had the mahogany V300 for years and I like it loads, but it is quite dark sounding. Mine simply cannot achieve a bright or spanky sound and once the strings have lost a bit of their newness it wouldn't be unfair to say it sounds a touch dull. I'm a big fan of it and think it's a bit of a bargain, but worth trying one out before buying and maybe auditioning alongside a spruce top guitar, depending on your tastes.

bertie · December 2022

Clecko said:
Totally agree with this. I've had the mahogany V300 for years and I like it loads, but it is quite dark sounding. Mine simply cannot achieve a bright or spanky sound and once the strings have lost a bit of their newness it wouldn't be unfair to say it sounds a touch dull. I'm a big fan of it and think it's a bit of a bargain, but worth trying one out before buying and maybe auditioning alongside a spruce top guitar, depending on your tastes.

careful, people have been banned (or worse) for agreeing with me on here

DavidR · December 2022

Kittyfrisk said:

Cracked record time Try out a Vintage V300MH if you can, as well as the recommended guitars above.
https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/227138/nagd-vintage-v300mh/p1

Ditto That. Have one. Mega. Paid £220 for mine. OO size. Very pretty Tone.

Details in this review thread I did a short while after purchase.

Dave_Mc · December 2022

bertie said:
I would definitely try some smaller bodied guitars before you buy, not all are made or sound equal and can vary massively in tone. You may not like what you hear so dont play just one

Yeah definitely. As I've said before (at length!) on here, I really didn't like the Faith Mercury for example (and I tried several examples across several of their ranges). And I'm a big fan of Faiths otherwise.

Clecko · December 2022

bertie said:

Clecko said:
Totally agree with this. I've had the mahogany V300 for years and I like it loads, but it is quite dark sounding. Mine simply cannot achieve a bright or spanky sound and once the strings have lost a bit of their newness it wouldn't be unfair to say it sounds a touch dull. I'm a big fan of it and think it's a bit of a bargain, but worth trying one out before buying and maybe auditioning alongside a spruce top guitar, depending on your tastes.

careful, people have been banned (or worse) for agreeing with me on here

Even a broken clock...

bertie · December 2022

Clecko said:
Even a broken clock...

even that went over my head

Andy79 · December 2022

Yorkie said:

My Yamaha electroacoustic dreadnought is too big for me. It’s only taken me >20 years to realise, but I’ve got there in the end. I need something smaller. I play and record blues (90% of time it’s clean, the other 10% through a Blues Driver). So I thought a parlour would be a good fit. I am fine with a purely acoustic model, and can’t spend more than £200 at this point anyway.

Are the Fender and Gretsch (Jim Dandy or something like that) models any good at that sub-200 price point?

Many thanks,
Jon

Small guitars can work but most don’t.
Martin can make an 0 size guitar sound huge and sweet. I like old ladder braced catalog ones as the (can) be loud due to their lightness and construction and are generally cheap

in my opinion, a modern shop-bought, cheap small guitar is likely to sound only boxy and lacking in bass and volume.

From long experience, one man’s ‘Blues Box’ is another man’s crock of shit.

equalsql · December 2022

paulnb57 said:

I have a Jim Dandy, I like it, I suppose they have their own sound, but are a great blueser

I concur, I have one too and it sounds very authentic in terms of early blue music. Those old blues guitars were dirt cheap models back in the day so I'm not sure if that's necessarily a good recommendation for the Jim Dandy. However if you're looking for a box for old blues picking and slide work that sounds like the real deal then it's definitely worth trying out one.

stufisher · December 2022

COPIED FROM THREAD 'SURPRISING GAS - SMALL ACOUSTICS' POSTED LAST WEEK

I'll probably be shot down in flames and banished to Hades for eternity for just whispering HB in a thread about top-end acoustics but @champ222 , you're treading the path I walked early this year and so, purely for completeness and possibly to save yourself a few hundred squiddlies for Christmas then perhaps you might wish to contemplate, with an open mind, one of these:

https://harleybenton.com/product/gs-travel-e-spruce/

I now hardly ever play my Tanglewood Dreadnought because I play the HB GS almost every day ... sometimes for up to 2 hours. It has transformed my view of small acoustics and enabled me to learn better, quicker and with less pain in my arthritic fretting hand.

It has worked SO well for me ... it may also work for you.

I can take the ridicule ... pachyderms R us

BTW it sounds really good through an amp

DavidR · December 2022

Self-evidently, you're never going to get the bottom end of larger bodied instruments from smaller ones. Nor perhaps the woody 'Woodstock' type growling. But you definitely can get marvellous tone, and you don't necessarily have to pay megabucks for it, so long as you look about.

Then there's the comfort. Increasingly important as you get older!

imho, every acoustic player should have a smaller, cheap, fun acoustic to doodle on, in comfort, and without fear of dinging it. Why not? Basically. :-)

Pjon · December 2022

equalsql said:

paulnb57 said:

I have a Jim Dandy, I like it, I suppose they have their own sound, but are a great blueser

I concur, I have one too and it sounds very authentic in terms of early blue music. Those old blues guitars were dirt cheap models back in the day so I'm not sure if that's necessarily a good recommendation for the Jim Dandy. However if you're looking for a box for old blues picking and slide work that sounds like the real deal then it's definitely worth trying out one.

I've had mine for a couple of years, mainly sitting next to the sofa in the living room where I can easily grab it and twang along brainlessly. (Or, you know, practice something!) It's not a sophisticated sounding thing, but then neither am I. It is mainly in open D or G tuning these days, blues, slide, whatever, and that suits it well. I don't need to worry about it being knocked over and it's robust enough that I've put a few dings on the edge. If I need a travel guitar, then this is the one I take. It is cheap. I would be disappointed if I broke it, but it wouldn't be the end of the world.

I like it but understand that not everyone will feel the same way. In fact, I was in PMT in Cardiff yesterday and wanted to try out something a little more expensive but in a similar size (maybe a PRS SE20) but couldn't see anything on display that caught my eye.

guitarjack66 · December 2022

I am put off HBs because the cheap one I bought is a crock of shite. Only cost 70 quid but its a hell of an achievement to make a cheap guitar sound even cheaper! I tried a Sigma travel before buying one of their GAs but should have bought their travel one as it was lovely.

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Cheap parlours: are Fender & Gretsch any good

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