String Recommendations for Flambeau FLW-3 & any info.

Soupman · July 2022

Looking for string recommendations for this particular guitar, and any further info anyone may have on it.

This is my Flambeau LFW-3 bought in 1985. 645mm scale length, 43mm nut with edgebound fingerboard.

The bridge pulled off about 5 yrs (culprit may have been ducted air heating). I had it repaired by a local shop who refitted it and put two screws though to plates underneath. ( I know, but it was a long time ago, my only guitar at that time, plus I was skint).

Since the bridge repair I stuck with D'addario phosphor bronze 10s for many years then switched to 11s D'add EJ36s - tried DR Rare & liked them.
Still seemed lacking a little, so a couple of months ago I fitted Newtone Heritage 12s as they are low tension and I have been pleased with them, but they are starting to slip tuning so time to replace.

I will add that I use Elixer 12s on a Lowden & like them. (Admittedly, part of that is I hate changing strings - I'd rather play it!)

I keep reading Tannin's string log which is great.

Question is, if the opinion is that it is cedar and walnut(?), what strings would you reckon work best with that combination, bearing in mind I like 12s and low tension would be preferable?

Info so far:

From googling, it seems they made 5 models (LFW-1 to LFW-5) with models 1 to 3 having laminate back & sides, models 4 & 5 being solid. All had solid tops.

The LFW is thought to stand for Lowden Flambeau Western.

I copied a text from another website (can't find it now!) signed by George Lowden :

"I designed the Flambeau guitars in the early

eighties as a favour to the Japanese export company I was working with

for the manufacture of the Lowden guitars. Although I had no control or

oversight of the manufacturing of the Flambeau guitars".

There was an LFW-3 (same as mine) on the Vintage & Rare website stating they were built in the S Yairi workshop in Nagoya, Japan with a cedar top & walnut back & sides, a string-through bridge (like Lowdens), inlaid rosette & pickguard.

Can anyone add to or verify any of this?
Thanks!

TheMadMick · July 2022

My only advice would be to try Lowden strings. The other option is you like and "old fashioned" sound, then Monel is a great option and they last for ever. I find them bright and jangly, but I like that in the context of our group where the rest are bass heavy and smooth.

Mellish · July 2022

Strings you could try:
DR Sunbeam
La Bella
Martin MA140
Pyramid Western Folk
D'Addario EJ11

Tannin · July 2022

My eye (however wrongly) confidently says walnut @Soupman and less confidently cedar (well-aged spruce can be that colour too). A close-up view might help. It looks like a lovely guitar. Anything out of the S. Yairi workshop in the 1980s is very likely very nice. (But you know that.) Lovely detail work in the close-ups.

You might want to go and have a chat to a luthier about that bridge. My understanding is that anything wooden repaired with screws or bolts is rather likely to play up again because of the concentration of stresses in a small area.

So what strings? Well, what do you want to achieve?

Do you want lower tension and easier fretting? (round cores (but brands vary), Santa Cruz, several others)
More volume? (Dunlop, Sfarzo.)
More treble zing? (brass, almost any brand)
More bass definition? (rough-finish strings like Ernie Ball, Martin, Rotosound)
Longer life? (Elixir and most other coated strings)
Firmer under the right hand and less buzzy but stiffer and harder to fret? (Elixir, John Pierce)
Very firm and very stiff0? (Dunlop)
Country twang? Curt Mangan.
No fretting-hand noise? (Elixir, any flatwound, Martin Monels)
Better balance from string to string? (Depends on which strings need more or less)
Flatter, less dynamic response? (Any nickel alloy string)
And then there are combinations like (just to make one up) lower tension, brighter, lovely soft feel, sweet warm voice (La Bella Golden Bronze - but watch out, they squeal like piglets in a mincer).
Or mellow, very easy on the hands, a bit like a nylon string (GHS silk and bronze)
And so on.

Don't take any of these as recommendations! I'm just throwing out examples off the top of my head. And most (but not all) of the examples above are extremes on one dimension or another. Most of my actual favourite strings are reasonably well balanced - not super bright or super soft or super anything, just a really nice combination.

Elixirs are quite stiff. Don't put Elixir 12s on, they will feel a gauge or even two gauges heavier than the Newtones. Elixir 11s? Maybe, maybe not. I hesitate to recommend any sort of 10s for an acoustic, but that's just me. BTW, I like all of the strings @Mellish mentions except the EJ11s which I haven't tried yet. But whether they are right for what you are trying to do is another question.

I gather that you like low tension and you enjoyed the Newtone Heritage set. If they are anything like the other Newtones I have tried, they will be very treble-heavy and a delight under the left hand. What makes you want to move on from the same again?

Oh, a while ago someone here (Artibear?) mentioned that Lowden strings are repackaged Cleartones. I thought my set of Cleartones was OK, nothing special, and hard work for the left hand.

Mellish · July 2022

@Tannin ; - yes, I was looking at the bridge. Nice guitar, though, I like it.

@Soupman ; - drop me a PM if you need a tech recommendation.

Cheers both

Soupman · July 2022

Thanks for this, fellas.

@TheMadmick I think Lowdon 12s would be a strain on the bridge if they're anything like the Elixers that Lowden used to recommend.
Used Martin's in the past but don't remember which ones - 'bright & jangly' isn't what I'm after. Thanks though.

@Mellish - tried Sunbeams before & seem to remember they were good. However, I found an unopened pack of EJ26s (p bronze 11s) so may stick 'em on.

@Tannin - wow, yes I think I need to decide what sound I'm looking for. I will study your advice/suggestions with a view to sorting out my requirements.

As to sound, I mostly use a thumbpick so reckon I'm looking for even string volume and a bit more volume, whilst trying to lower the string tension for the bridge. I'm not worried about ease of fretting so much.

Detail of soundboard/ bridge showing the repair. I seem to remember the chap said he'd re-glued it as well as putting the 2 screws through.
I could take it to a Luthier but what do I ask him to do?
From what I gather it's not worth a lot, it was always a mid-range instrument at best, although I do love it.

Big thanks to all for the replies, most helpful !

bugileman · August 2022

The flambeau guitars were never made with solid back and sides! All laminate, but they do look convincingly good. They are quality guitars. The base model has a laminate top, whilst higher models had a solid top. Personally I prefer the Artisan (George Lowden designed) guitars made at the same time in Japan. They have the edge on the sound front in my opinion. I've owned 12 string models and 6 string, they are good quality and not so easy to come by now, but I think the actual total made has been widely exaggerated!!!!

Soupman · August 2022

Thanks for that @bugileman .
I knew there weren't many made. I read here people saying 'try several before you buy' but when I bought it there weren't any others if I remember correctly (it was 30-odd years ago).
My choice came down to the Flambeau or a Washburn in another shop half a mile down the road. I went between the two a few times

.

TheMadMick · August 2022

you want "As to sound, I mostly use a thumbpick so reckon I'm looking for even string volume and a bit more volume, whilst trying to lower the string tension for the bridge. I'm not worried about ease of fretting so much."

An option I'm working on just now is Silk and steel. They are lighter than the standard 12's and are lower tension. They are said to give a bass tone quite like a classical (which I find potentially attractive). However, cheap they are not - but what strings are these days?

Soupman · August 2022

@TheMadMick do the silk & steel :
a) have ball ends and
b) do they work with a soundhole magnetic pickup ?
(I occasionally take it to open mic nights or plug it into a DAW).
Thanks!

Tannin · August 2022

Funny you should mention that @TheMadMick Just today I wrote up something that might be the very thing.

These are Pyramid 307 Silver-Plated. I bought them from Strings by Mail for $18.83 AUD (£10.50) including postage from the USA. (UK prices are usually way dearer than the US or even Australia, partly because of your worst-of-breed VAT which at 20% is a fair-dinkum shocker. But for once, Strings Direct in the UK list them for £8, only they seem to be are out of stock.of 12s, which would be the gauge to have.) And I see that Thomann have them in stock at £4.22 including VAT, which is a screaming bargain.

The 307s are really interesting strings! They are very soft and flexible under the fingers, an invitation to fast and fancy fretting. The silver coating is not rough or raspy but it micro-grips the fingertips as if it was coated in rosin or non-slip rubber (that sounds unpleasant but isn't). They are very light for 12s, more like 10s but perfectly playable nevertheless. (This is why I say get the 12s. 11s would be crazy light.)

Their sound belongs to the same broad family as a standard set of, for example, phosphor bronze strings, but without the stridency. It has a gentle, very slightly muted flavour not unlike (but much more subtle than) a silk and steel sound. They excel at fingerstyle but strum happily too. (Contrast with silk and steel which tend to flub a bit of you strum them.)

I put them on my Mineur (luthier-built concert size guitar) and it loves them. I think they would also go very well on any melodic, sweet-voiced guitar. For @Soupman they might be the very thing.

TheMadMick · August 2022

Soupman said:

@TheMadMick do the silk & steel :
a) have ball ends and
b) do they work with a soundhole magnetic pickup ?
(I occasionally take it to open mic nights or plug it into a DAW).
Thanks!

The Martin ones do have a ball end.

They are wound on steel cores so I assume a magnetic pick up would "see them".

Soupman · August 2022

@TheMadMick @Tannin ;; thanks for the input fellas.
Pyramid 307s seem like rocking horse crap here in UK.
The best was Thomann but the postage was £8, however a multiple order also seems to ship for same, so not bad.
I haven't tried the silk & steel but will keep them in mind for the future.
I said I was pleased with the Newtone Heritage 12s, and have just placed an order for a set of Heritage 11s as they have a little less tension.
This guitar mainly gets played at home, so not a need for volume.

Tannin · August 2022

Veering off-topic now, but why does no-one here seem to buy strings from the USA? There are at least two outstanding dealers with great prices and huge ranges, and very fast, friendly service. (Strings and Beyond and Strings by Mail.) They have lots of stuff that is otherwise hard to find, and postage isn't much if you spread it across a few sets in one go.

Mellish · August 2022

@Tannin ; why? Well, maybe, better the devil you know. Or with Strings Direct, say, it's next day delivery?

But for me, I just find the Strings by Mail and Strings and Beyond websites more complicated, maybe cos I'm not used to them

Tannin · August 2022

Mate, one of these days someone is going to have to introduce you to some of these sophisticated but confusing modern technologies you battle with, such as on-board pickups, tin openers, fountain pens, and the Strings by Mail website.

But sure, I see the fast delivery angle. Strings Direct are way more expensive than anywhere in the USA or Germany - largely no doubt because of the insane VAT rate in the UK. I was wondering if perhaps you have to pay 20% VAT on a set of strings from the USA, or something like that.

Soupman · August 2022

@Tannin , Strings by mail price their stuff in dollars, so we not only pay vat but also the greedy bank conversion rate of $ to £.
Thomann have their prices in £ and include the vat. I've never used them but as you mention, one shipping fee for a few sets seems good value.

Mellish · August 2022

@Soupman ; came back to say that about. $ to £ to find you'd beaten me to it

Tannin · August 2022

So Strings by Mail actually charge you the VAT?

(They charge me Aussie GST, but 10% is bearable. And in any case there is a way around it, which I won't mention here in this family environment.)

Soupman · August 2022

@Tannin there was a box to tick in the checkout screen where they added in the vat for you, if I remember correctly.
But it was still priced in dollars I think, hence the conversion bank fees.

TheMadMick · August 2022

Tannin said:

Mate, one of these days someone is going to have to introduce you to some of these sophisticated but confusing modern technologies you battle with, such as on-board pickups, tin openers, fountain pens, and the Strings by Mail website.

But sure, I see the fast delivery angle. Strings Direct are way more expensive than anywhere in the USA or Germany - largely no doubt because of the insane VAT rate in the UK. I was wondering if perhaps you have to pay 20% VAT on a set of strings from the USA, or something like that.

If your package does not fly under the customs radar the tax and fees look like:

Import tax 6%

VAT 20% Both these on the cost and postage.

Post office collection fee £10.00 (or it was years ago when I ordered stuff from overseas).

Not really viable for those who are unlucky enough to get caught.

Tannin · August 2022

Wow. Bit of a walled garden, isn't it! No wonder people are grumpy about Brexit. I didn't realise how bad things were.

Soupman · August 2022

I've fitted Newtone Heritage 11s, (great strings) and the lower tension meant I had to tweak the truss rod.
I reckon the action at the 12th fret could be lowered by sanding the saddle, but before doing that-

Question:
Would there be any advantage in swapping the saddle out for a bone one? (Not the nut, I'm not touching that!)
If so, do they all have the same radius or do I need those radius measuring gauge template things?
Lastly, the Newtones are round core- if I loosen the tension to remove the saddle, are they going to slip the core? If so I'll wait until a new set are needed.

Mellish · August 2022

@Soupman ; what material is your existing saddle?

If plastic, bone will make a difference. However, not everyone can hear it, so it's hard to say *you* will

EDIT - no, they don't all have the same radius.

Soupman · August 2022

@Mellish , that's a good question. It's the original saddle but the truthful answer is that I don't know. It's not compensated but the intonation seems very good.

Using a steel rule the btm E string measures about 1.75ish mm and the top E a gnat's whisker over 2mm.
Does that sound average?

Tannin · August 2022

I would not want it any lower. YMMV but I'd be buzzing notes and sitaring if I took one lower than that. If you have a very gentle right hand you might be different.

Mellish · August 2022

I'd agree with @Tannin.

My Dove's low E is at 2.48mm and that gives me plenty of volume.

You can take away all of a guitar's fire by dropping action. 2mm at the 12th is lower than I'd want but I'm a hard strummer

Mellish · August 2022

@soupm ; what makes you think you need to take the action lower than 2mm on the low E?

Before you do anything to the saddle check the neck relief.

Soupman · August 2022

I'd never needed to adjust the truss rod before, but 5 or 6 weeks ago, I picked it up & the action was noticeably higher.
It stands out all the time so maybe it was because of the warm weather - humidity has never been a problem up here.
I tightened the truss rod to correct this.

When the latest Newtones (11s) were fitted, I checked the fretboard & found it had no relief (ie it was flat). I slackened the truss rod to get the small relief at the 6th fret.(Hold string at 1st & 14th fret, check at 6). Having done that & played it a bit, I just felt it was a tad high, hence the question.
After the advice from your good selves I will leave it as it is, and check the neck relief in a couple of days after it settles down. I'm not one for messing about unnecessarily, 'if it works leave it alone'!

Thanks for the advice, this forum really excels at this.

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String Recommendations for Flambeau FLW-3 & any info.

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