Thread Update. Cheap Synths? Opinions/Alternatives

TeleMaster · March 2021

Yea I've seen them. The XD looks better all round to be honest. I also wouldn't say I'm a piano player either but I can play enough that 4 voices could be limited, but I also need to realise that I'm learning this instrument and it's NOT the piano. Analogue also just sounds better in most examples with synths at this price point.

Man... I shouldn't have sold my Dave Smith Prophet

paulmapp8306 · March 2021

From a basic perspective, 4 voice is fine if your playing bass lines, lead lines, arpeggiators (played or sequenced).

If you plan on playing chord work, pads, key sounds then 4 voices wont be enough./ The novelty will wear off pretty quick.

The other aspect when 4 voices would be fine is if your just using it to learn synthesis/sound design on, and not reallyt planning on using it as a stand alone instrument.

TeleMaster · March 2021

Perhaps this is a blessing in disguise then, because Andertons called me and told me that the XD they had was a display model and it's got a dent in it.

@Paulmapp8306 perhaps I should just get the Cobalt then.

paulmapp8306 · March 2021

possibly. mono synths are great, and the XD does some wonderful things in that context, and in its 4 voice poly mode- but its one "part" of a sound, or piece of music. Its fun to play with , great to sound design, but as a sole instrument very limiting, The ability to play 5 notes is a minimum IMO for stand alone. Thats a 4 note chord plus a bass note - or a 3 note chord with two bass notes an octave apart. Both are key to pads.

Even then - you get note stealing/cutoffs with longer decay times on the envelopes. using reverb to hand the decays almost becomes necessary (and was used a lot in the 80s to mask the problems with low poly count synths).

As such - 5 or 6 notes minimum IF the synth has that special something (P5 rev 4, P6, OB6, Polybrute etc), 8 as a general minimum for mono timbral and 12-16 for duel timbral - UNLESS its a bass line, lead line, learning synthesis or one part of a wider sonic pallet.

Of course this is only my viewpoint.

TeleMaster · March 2021

Well I've gone gone for the Cobalt 8. I think the extra chords and the features make it a good option. I'll have it Tuesday, I'll update you all.

TeleMaster · March 2021

There's a 20% off voucher on eBay at the moment so I got it for £500 which is great!

Creed_Clicks · March 2021

TeleMaster said:

Well I've gone gone for the Cobalt 8. I think the extra chords and the features make it a good option. I'll have it Tuesday, I'll update you all.

Please do , would be curious to see what you think!

Creed_Clicks · March 2021

I would definitely like to add some effects pedals after the synth and a loop pedal and jam as I would on a guitar...

paulmapp8306 · March 2021

@TeleMaster ;

I think you'll enjoy it, even though its VA. Its more up my street than the Argon I have, but then I has so much that can do the VA thing (and analogue) already it didnt make sense to have more of the same.

paulmapp8306 · March 2021

Creed_Clicks said:

I would definitely like to add some effects pedals after the synth and a loop pedal and jam as I would on a guitar...

Zoom Multistomp. relatively cheap, stereo in/out, takes line level signals, FX are decent enough unless you want stunning reverbs and mega versatile delays - but still decent. Models of some classic pedals rather than newly designed FX. I use one to get a few FX my synths dont have on board and Im happy enough.

https://www.scan.co.uk/products/zoom-ms70cdr-modulation-stomp-chorus-delay-reverb-pedal-86-effects?gclid=Cj0KCQjw0oCDBhCPARIsAII3C_H3fk0-oZpaLUNqC1Z_6927HVzKwI6K7P87SQ7IVoQCd-9H_vDUy8IaAr_nEALw_wcB

TeleMaster · March 2021

Okay I've been having dramas today.

So the Minilogue XD I ordered ended up being a display model with a big ding in it or something.

So I get a Cobalt 8 and the seller tells me they've actually sold out.

So I'm looking around and I see a Prologue 8 available for £900. So I thought, fuck it. Let's get that. And it's coming tomorrow. I could have got the 16 voice version for £1050 used but it's just too big for me.

This seems very familiar as it's similar in set out to the Minilogue and it's got a lot of cool features.

I didn't need it but I wanted it. Wish it had a sequencer but I'm gonna use my DAW for that. Don't let me sell it, trade it, or buy another synth. I need to learn this one inside out.

TeleMaster · March 2021

Also, I think this is now our noob synth user thread!

paulmapp8306 · March 2021

prologue is basically a minilogue XD with more voices (the good bit) and keys (another good bit). It does make it useable for me, and despite the limited envelopes and LFOs, is a really nice sounding synth. If I had room for the 8/16 I may well have had one, but I didnt have that space, and the Minilogue XD has those limitations Ive spoken about.

gusman2x · March 2021

Deepmind 12 on Amazon U.K. for £600 just now. Such a good deal I had to order one!

paulmapp8306 · March 2021

Happy with my DM12 module. Its not a juno really (despite being modelled one) but it definitely has the same character - and with more sound shaping options.

TeleMaster · March 2021

paulmapp8306 said:

prologue is basically a minilogue XD with more voices (the good bit) and keys (another good bit). It does make it useable for me, and despite the limited envelopes and LFOs, is a really nice sounding synth. If I had room for the 8/16 I may well have had one, but I didnt have that space, and the Minilogue XD has those limitations Ive spoken about.

I do wonder if the single LFO will become a big limitation. As the only bigger synth I own, I do wonder if I should have gone for something with more options but I am also learning so simpler is probably better. And it has a lot of cool features not found on other synths.

TeleMaster · March 2021

Am enjoying this thing a lot. The bi-timbral stuff is very cool. The presets are also excellent.

I’ve been playing Syntorial too. Wondering whether to purchase the whole thing. In case you’re not aware, it’s an app that teaches you how to program a synth and does it via a game type format where you have to match the sounds you hear. It goes through all the sections and then you have a test at the end. £120 for the full version though!

Creed_Clicks · March 2021

I am picking up a used minilogue today. Even after the advice here and lots and lots of video demos, I think it will be fine for what I want it for , for the time being. Combined with some VSTs, I'll have lots of sonic sounds covered and I plan on sticking my guitar pedals after it anyhow. I'll either upgrade next year or move back to VSTs and a good midi keyboard.
The Deepmind 6 looks good, so will keep an eye on that too in the meantime.

paulmapp8306 · March 2021

TeleMaster said:

paulmapp8306 said:

prologue is basically a minilogue XD with more voices (the good bit) and keys (another good bit). It does make it useable for me, and despite the limited envelopes and LFOs, is a really nice sounding synth. If I had room for the 8/16 I may well have had one, but I didnt have that space, and the Minilogue XD has those limitations Ive spoken about.

I do wonder if the single LFO will become a big limitation. As the only bigger synth I own, I do wonder if I should have gone for something with more options but I am also learning so simpler is probably better. And it has a lot of cool features not found on other synths.

One LFO at the start isnt bad - profit 6 and OB 6 only have 1. More limiting is actually the AD envelope rather than a full ADSR. HOWEVER, at the learning stage it has everything you want. The opens source 3rd Oscillator is great - while digital, there are many 3rd parts packs out there that have extra LFOs and Envs built into them. Access is a PITA mind - but they are there if you absolutely need them.

TeleMaster · March 2021

The thing also is that we can always find more, and look at one thing and say it has this or haven’t. Lots of things I was looking at didn’t have the bi-timbral or didn’t have the 3rd oscillator. I think the problem with a market this big is you’ll always feel like there’s other stuff out there that does stuff quite different and unless you spend a lot, you’ll always be missing out on something.

A guitar on the other hand is ultimately a guitar and you can do pretty much everything with one guitar.

paulmapp8306 · March 2021

TeleMaster said:

and you can do pretty much everything with one guitar.

I beg to differ.... particularly if the wife is listening....

horse · March 2021

TeleMaster said:

The thing also is that we can always find more, and look at one thing and say it has this or haven’t. Lots of things I was looking at didn’t have the bi-timbral or didn’t have the 3rd oscillator. I think the problem with a market this big is you’ll always feel like there’s other stuff out there that does stuff quite different and unless you spend a lot, you’ll always be missing out on something.

A guitar on the other hand is ultimately a guitar and you can do pretty much everything with one guitar.

In the old days people would buy an instrument and enjoy exploring what it could do without issue. These days thanks to the internet that experience can be somewhat influenced by fomo.

TeleMaster · March 2021

paulmapp8306 said:

TeleMaster said:

paulmapp8306 said:

prologue is basically a minilogue XD with more voices (the good bit) and keys (another good bit). It does make it useable for me, and despite the limited envelopes and LFOs, is a really nice sounding synth. If I had room for the 8/16 I may well have had one, but I didnt have that space, and the Minilogue XD has those limitations Ive spoken about.

I do wonder if the single LFO will become a big limitation. As the only bigger synth I own, I do wonder if I should have gone for something with more options but I am also learning so simpler is probably better. And it has a lot of cool features not found on other synths.

More limiting is actually the AD envelope rather than a full ADSR.

I believe this has a full ADSR. I can see Amp and EG both with ADSR.

TeleMaster · March 2021

horse said:

TeleMaster said:

The thing also is that we can always find more, and look at one thing and say it has this or haven’t. Lots of things I was looking at didn’t have the bi-timbral or didn’t have the 3rd oscillator. I think the problem with a market this big is you’ll always feel like there’s other stuff out there that does stuff quite different and unless you spend a lot, you’ll always be missing out on something.

A guitar on the other hand is ultimately a guitar and you can do pretty much everything with one guitar.

In the old days people would buy an instrument and enjoy exploring what it could do without issue. These days thanks to the internet that experience can be somewhat influenced by fomo.

So true. It’s a curse.

paulmapp8306 · March 2021

TeleMaster said:

paulmapp8306 said:

TeleMaster said:

paulmapp8306 said:

prologue is basically a minilogue XD with more voices (the good bit) and keys (another good bit). It does make it useable for me, and despite the limited envelopes and LFOs, is a really nice sounding synth. If I had room for the 8/16 I may well have had one, but I didnt have that space, and the Minilogue XD has those limitations Ive spoken about.

I do wonder if the single LFO will become a big limitation. As the only bigger synth I own, I do wonder if I should have gone for something with more options but I am also learning so simpler is probably better. And it has a lot of cool features not found on other synths.

More limiting is actually the AD envelope rather than a full ADSR.

I believe this has a full ADSR. I can see Amp and EG both with ADSR.

Unfortunately not. The amp envelope is full ADSR, the 2nd - envelope generator (freely assignable but would generally be the filter envelope) is attack/decay only. No SR phase..... unless its had a hardware revision in the last couple of n=moths - but Ive heard nothing, and the manual still refers to only attack, decay and amount (intensity) for the EG.

Grangousier · March 2021

while(n=='moths'){
n.eat('wool');
}

Sorry, don't get the chance to do code-based gags very often, even non-funny ones. I think I mixed up PHP and Javascript there.

Glad I was the guitar player in my particular post-punk industrial combo, as I don't think I'd have the space for synths too - the synth specialist in that band these days seems to have a room entirely filled with Euroracks and bleeping (it used to be one MS-10). I gave him an old SK-1 sampler and TR-626 drum machine and he had them modded - they're now full of patch sockets and make even more bizarre sounds than they did before.

Have fun with the bleep-machine!

TeleMaster · March 2021

paulmapp8306 said:

TeleMaster said:

paulmapp8306 said:

TeleMaster said:

paulmapp8306 said:

prologue is basically a minilogue XD with more voices (the good bit) and keys (another good bit). It does make it useable for me, and despite the limited envelopes and LFOs, is a really nice sounding synth. If I had room for the 8/16 I may well have had one, but I didnt have that space, and the Minilogue XD has those limitations Ive spoken about.

I do wonder if the single LFO will become a big limitation. As the only bigger synth I own, I do wonder if I should have gone for something with more options but I am also learning so simpler is probably better. And it has a lot of cool features not found on other synths.

More limiting is actually the AD envelope rather than a full ADSR.

I believe this has a full ADSR. I can see Amp and EG both with ADSR.

Unfortunately not. The amp envelope is full ADSR, the 2nd - envelope generator (freely assignable but would generally be the filter envelope) is attack/decay only. No SR phase..... unless its had a hardware revision in the last couple of n=moths - but Ive heard nothing, and the manual still refers to only attack, decay and amount (intensity) for the EG.

Are you talking about the Minilogue? Which I believe has what you're talking about.

I have the Prologue 8. I have Attack Sustain Decay Release for both the Amp EG and the filter.

Unless I'm missing something...

paulmapp8306 · April 2021

TeleMaster said:

paulmapp8306 said:

TeleMaster said:

paulmapp8306 said:

TeleMaster said:

paulmapp8306 said:

prologue is basically a minilogue XD with more voices (the good bit) and keys (another good bit). It does make it useable for me, and despite the limited envelopes and LFOs, is a really nice sounding synth. If I had room for the 8/16 I may well have had one, but I didnt have that space, and the Minilogue XD has those limitations Ive spoken about.

I do wonder if the single LFO will become a big limitation. As the only bigger synth I own, I do wonder if I should have gone for something with more options but I am also learning so simpler is probably better. And it has a lot of cool features not found on other synths.

More limiting is actually the AD envelope rather than a full ADSR.

I believe this has a full ADSR. I can see Amp and EG both with ADSR.

Unfortunately not. The amp envelope is full ADSR, the 2nd - envelope generator (freely assignable but would generally be the filter envelope) is attack/decay only. No SR phase..... unless its had a hardware revision in the last couple of n=moths - but Ive heard nothing, and the manual still refers to only attack, decay and amount (intensity) for the EG.

Are you talking about the Minilogue? Which I believe has what you're talking about.

I have the Prologue 8. I have Attack Sustain Decay Release for both the Amp EG and the filter.

Unless I'm missing something...

No - my fault..... We were originally talking the minilogue went we - I got confused lol.

Not the prologue has full ADSR, so your good.

TeleMaster · April 2021

Anyone used a Grandmother? My friend is selling his cheap and has told me he'll take my minilogue and microbrute plus £75 for it so I've decided to go for it. Looks like a cool mono synth!

Creed_Clicks · April 2021

Had a Minilogue for a few weeks, sold it for what I bought it for, could have made more but hey ho. Too honest.
Bought a Yamaha Reface CS for the basic simplicity and a Microfreak. Microfreak is great fun, but my luddite brain is still trying to figure out the Matrix. I like the Reface. Lots in it.
Will sell one of them next year.

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Thread Update. Cheap Synths? Opinions/Alternatives

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