Going unplugged but I've never had a decent accoustic - suggestions..?

ICBM · January 2021

JRgtar said:

Interesting, is this because the inbuilt pickups are not as good as aftermarket options? Appreciate you may be paying a premium then for something that isn’t great.

Yes, you're paying a premium for a system which is usually not as good as you could fit yourself if you had the choice, and which often involves having a big hole cut in the guitar for the preamp box. This is a bad idea, because firstly it can actually affect the acoustic sound of the guitar, and secondly it's usually a unique size which makes replacing or upgrading it in the future difficult - so you're left with a nicely ageing acoustic guitar fitted with an obsolete preamp system. They are also surprisingly prone to failure.

It's much better to get a pure acoustic guitar, and if you need to amplify it, fit it with a simple onboard pickup and an output jack - then run it through an outboard preamp, which can be replaced or upgraded at any time with zero trouble. The only reason I would have onboard electrics is if I was playing gigs where I really needed hands-on control of my own sound - I have, in the past, so I had a guitar like that. I'm glad I don't have it now, because the system - which was pretty good in its day - would now sound very dated.

One thing you'll find which is very annoying is that it's now quite difficult to buy a cutaway acoustic without fitted electrics - there seems to be an assumption that the two things go together.

Dominic · January 2021

To me nothing sounds as nice as a Lowden .......almost Grand Piano like in clarity
I hate the fuzzy boom of a Martin
Taylor is a great compromise and I find them very easy to play

Andy79 · January 2021

Original 50s (fat neck) or 60s (thinner) J45?
lightweight, lively, punchy, full rich tone with thudding bass. Cool looking too

JRgtar · January 2021

ICBM said:

JRgtar said:

Interesting, is this because the inbuilt pickups are not as good as aftermarket options? Appreciate you may be paying a premium then for something that isn’t great.

Yes, you're paying a premium for a system which is usually not as good as you could fit yourself if you had the choice, and which often involves having a big hole cut in the guitar for the preamp box. This is a bad idea, because firstly it can actually affect the acoustic sound of the guitar, and secondly it's usually a unique size which makes replacing or upgrading it in the future difficult - so you're left with a nicely ageing acoustic guitar fitted with an obsolete preamp system. They are also surprisingly prone to failure.

It's much better to get a pure acoustic guitar, and if you need to amplify it, fit it with a simple onboard pickup and an output jack - then run it through an outboard preamp, which can be replaced or upgraded at any time with zero trouble. The only reason I would have onboard electrics is if I was playing gigs where I really needed hands-on control of my own sound - I have, in the past, so I had a guitar like that. I'm glad I don't have it now, because the system - which was pretty good in its day - would now sound very dated.

One thing you'll find which is very annoying is that it's now quite difficult to buy a cutaway acoustic without fitted electrics - there seems to be an assumption that the two things go together.

Thanks, really useful answer, it’s appreciated. I also know what you mean about the cutaway and pickup always included thing, very true.

I found my acoustic, loved the sound, but was slightly concerned I’d made an error not getting one with a pickup, but the logic you use makes me think otherwise.

BingMan · January 2021

Guess it all depends on how you define 'decent'
The tone of an acoustic is incredible subjective so these topics always turn into what other members like... which isn't to say that you'll like the same thing.

I'd start by listening to what sort of music you like, and find out what artists you admire plays what.
Of course, "you can play anything on anything", as they say... but it's a starting point and maybe will give your search some direction and focus.

I could list all the top builders going... but we don't have much to go off without some idea of budget, or types of music you like to play

Do you play blues? Country? Bluegrass? Fingerstyle? Slide? OASIS?!
Is £1000 where your head is at? £2000? £3000? £10,000? pre-war Martin d28 money?!

think If anyone is going to really be able to point you in the right direction we're going to need some more to go off!

meltedbuzzbox · January 2021

BingMan said:

Guess it all depends on how you define 'decent'
The tone of an acoustic is incredible subjective so these topics always turn into what other members like... which isn't to say that you'll like the same thing.

I'd start by listening to what sort of music you like, and find out what artists you admire plays what.
Of course, "you can play anything on anything", as they say... but it's a starting point and maybe will give your search some direction and focus.

I could list all the top builders going... but we don't have much to go off without some idea of budget, or types of music you like to play

Do you play blues? Country? Bluegrass? Fingerstyle? Slide? OASIS?!
Is £1000 where your head is at? £2000? £3000? £10,000? pre-war Martin d28 money?!

think If anyone is going to really be able to point you in the right direction we're going to need some more to go off!

You can't pick a guitar based on type of music you play. Unless you have a real desire to sound like a carbon copy of someone else. The notes dictate what the music is, not the guitar

Jalapeno · January 2021

As mid budget guitars go, Faith & Breedlove taking some beating. Sure a Martin if you can afford it as it is a lifer investment.

meltedbuzzbox · January 2021

Jalapeno said:

As mid budget guitars go, Faith & Breedlove taking some beating. Sure a Martin if you can afford it as it is a lifer investment.

I was a happy faith player for years. Totally agree that in their price range they are really nice.

Breedlove... I played the top end model that they had in coda. It had more bass than a bazooka. It dominated everything, it even managed to drown out @impmann trying to play a guitar on the otherside of the room. Absolutely mental thing.

I have to say though, there was a massive difference between the martin I bought and the faith I traded in.
To be fair the price reflected that too

drofluf · January 2021

meltedbuzzbox said:

Jalapeno said:

As mid budget guitars go, Faith & Breedlove taking some beating. Sure a Martin if you can afford it as it is a lifer investment.

I was a happy faith player for years. Totally agree that in their price range they are really nice.

Breedlove... I played the top end model that they had in coda. It had more bass than a bazooka. It dominated everything, it even managed to drown out @impmann trying to play a guitar on the otherside of the room. Absolutely mental thing.

I have to say though, there was a massive difference between the martin I bought and the faith I traded in.
To be fair the price reflected that too

Never played a Breedlove but agree 100% with the rest. Was totally happy with my Faith before I got my Martin but they’re different price brackets.

But as @BingMan said you need to at least specify a budget.

Snags · January 2021

If you're not worried about the name on the headstock, currently have no acoustic at all, and want to just get something that works for a reasonable price then based on a combination of personal experience and observation around the local open mic circuit, it's worth considering Faith, Furch, Eastman, Yamaha, Guild, Tanglewood.

Budget-wise new that's likely to start around £500-ish and rise to as many thousands as you want to throw at it.

Tone71 · January 2021

Loads of good advise above but I think it is what you want and view as a decent guitar that matters.

Having had loads of acoustics over the years I have always wanted a Martin but had never been in a position to buy one through one thing or another, this has led to lots and lots of buying and selling, the journey of playing loads of different makes, models and styles has been great and really helped to crystallise what I "really" want in a guitar, one that would stick around for ages hopefully to see me out and be passed down etc etc.

The whole issue now is that there is nowhere to go and spend a few hours playing which makes it really hard.

I personally really like Taylors, have had a fair few and still have a 320e which covers a lot of ground but isn't comfy for a sofa guitar for me being small, the necks on all the Taylors I've ever had though have been the most comfy.

The best sofa guitar I've had was a Guild (might have been a m240e, can't remember now) as the price, size and sound ticked a lot of boxes and I probably regret selling that one the most but again it didn't say Martin on the head!

Ultimately it depends on what you `'really" want....

FWIW I am about to buy the long coveted Martin and have spent far too many hours researching and getting lost in tone woods, overthinking what is essentially a simple choice, something that will provide happiness, has everything that I want on a guitar and will make me want to pick up and play regularly.

Enjoy!!

Neill · January 2021

Tone71 said:

Loads of good advise above but I think it is what you want and view as a decent guitar that matters.

Having had loads of acoustics over the years I have always wanted a Martin but had never been in a position to buy one through one thing or another, this has led to lots and lots of buying and selling, the journey of playing loads of different makes, models and styles has been great and really helped to crystallise what I "really" want in a guitar, one that would stick around for ages hopefully to see me out and be passed down etc etc.

The whole issue now is that there is nowhere to go and spend a few hours playing which makes it really hard.

I personally really like Taylors, have had a fair few and still have a 320e which covers a lot of ground but isn't comfy for a sofa guitar for me being small, the necks on all the Taylors I've ever had though have been the most comfy.

The best sofa guitar I've had was a Guild (might have been a m240e, can't remember now) as the price, size and sound ticked a lot of boxes and I probably regret selling that one the most but again it didn't say Martin on the head!

Ultimately it depends on what you `'really" want....

FWIW I am about to buy the long coveted Martin and have spent far too many hours researching and getting lost in tone woods, overthinking what is essentially a simple choice, something that will provide happiness, has everything that I want on a guitar and will make me want to pick up and play regularly.

Enjoy!!

I think this is where I'm coming from, I can play a few tunes/songs on acoustic but I'm not totally confident in my technique - you can get away with sloppy playing on electric, and of course playing in a band covers a multitude of sins... But I want to get to a stage where I can confidently play stuff solo and that involves practice. So, I need a guitar that will make me want to practice.

Since I stopped gigging I sold most of my gear and I now bitterly regret parting with my Flying V - it seemed to make sense at the time as I bought it as a rig to play live and as I couldn't envisage playing live in the future... But the thing about that guitar was I couldn't look at it without picking it up and playing something, and it's such an important quality.

Having done the rounds on Youtube I find myself drawn to the Martin 00-15M, it looks about the right size and sounds terrific, to my ears anyway. There may be an awkward foot shuffling discussion with my other half looming...

ICBM · January 2021

Neill said:

Having done the rounds on Youtube I find myself drawn to the Martin 00-15M, it looks about the right size and sounds terrific, to my ears anyway. There may be an awkward foot shuffling discussion with my other half looming...

Those are nice.

Although I do prefer Dreadnoughts, my other guitar is a Vintage V300M - a cheap copy of one of those Martins, basically. It sounds very good, and different enough from my Dreadnought that I like them both. I'd buy the Martin if I could justify spending the extra though - or one of the Guilds that are about halfway between the two price-wise, they're nice as well.

drofluf · January 2021

Neill said:

Having done the rounds on Youtube I find myself drawn to the Martin 00-15M, it looks about the right size and sounds terrific, to my ears anyway. There may be an awkward foot shuffling discussion with my other half looming...

I’ve a 000-15M and it’s the guitar that I don’t want to put down. So I doubt you will go wrong with the 00 size.

BingMan · January 2021

meltedbuzzbox said:

BingMan said:

Guess it all depends on how you define 'decent'
The tone of an acoustic is incredible subjective so these topics always turn into what other members like... which isn't to say that you'll like the same thing.

I'd start by listening to what sort of music you like, and find out what artists you admire plays what.
Of course, "you can play anything on anything", as they say... but it's a starting point and maybe will give your search some direction and focus.

I could list all the top builders going... but we don't have much to go off without some idea of budget, or types of music you like to play

Do you play blues? Country? Bluegrass? Fingerstyle? Slide? OASIS?!
Is £1000 where your head is at? £2000? £3000? £10,000? pre-war Martin d28 money?!

think If anyone is going to really be able to point you in the right direction we're going to need some more to go off!

You can't pick a guitar based on type of music you play. Unless you have a real desire to sound like a carbon copy of someone else. The notes dictate what the music is, not the guitar

Profound

Yeah, read my original post... I did mention that you can play anything on any guitar, but in this instance it might at least help as a starting point.

If this were an electric guitar hunt, and say you really liked the Beach Boys and wanted to get into playing drippy surf music, going out and buying a pointy BC Rich, high gain, shredding machine ain't going to deliver on the sound you had in your head... You're only going to be disappointed... even if someone on a forum says they are great guitars.

If you're into playing blues, maybe you want a shorter scale length for easier bending
If fingerstyle is your thing then you'll want to maybe consider slightly wider string spacing
Or not
It's your choice.
But it's stuff you should consider before dropping your hard earned.
And it's these bits of crucial information that can help steer a search.

A guitar is a tool like any other.

And you can't tell me you'd be happy using a pneumatic drill to hang a picture

DamianM · January 2021

Alvarez and Recording King make great stuff if you don't mind where it is made-

Schnozz · January 2021

Tanglewood > Eastman > Martin

I really like Yamaha too, but they're not copying Martin like the above.

boogieman · January 2021

I guess this thread just goes to show all people have different opinions on what’s good or not.

My 2p worth. I played dreadnaughts for years but a while back I found I struggled with my Takamine as it gave me a terrible ache in my arm. It was all to do with the position of my fretting hand when I sat with a wider body guitar. I switched over to a small bodied Martin and have never looked back. (I happen to like the sound of Martins too, to me they’re the classic sound of a good acoustic.). So, dreads definitely aren’t for everyone.

It’s going to be difficult choosing something at the moment without getting your hands on one and listening to the tone. The nearest I got to solving that problem of demoing a new guitar was listening to the clips on the Peach site. Luckily the Martin I bought from them suits me perfectly and I’d recommend Peach to anyone. You do have the luxury of sending it back under the Distance Selling rules if it doesn’t suit of course.

Benm39 · January 2021

Brook definitely worth a look as a small producer of high quality hand built instruments. Might be abit spendy though unless you can find second hand. TheTaw OM has a shorter scale length which makes it incredibly easy to play, coupled with a neck profile more akin to an electric. Tone will depend on wood choices but I find the sitka spruce and rosewood to have a great clarity without being overly bright.

Furch definitely worth a look alongside Eastman too... all solid wood from the blue range upwards and, if you can stretch into yellow range territory then these seem to be really high quality at a great price. The 2018 LX OM I tried at Coda was simply stunning visually and sonically.

Enjoy the search and your new instrument once you find it.

Neill · January 2021

Benm39 said:

Brook definitely worth a look as a small producer of high quality hand built instruments. Might be abit spendy though unless you can find second hand. TheTaw OM has a shorter scale length which makes it incredibly easy to play, coupled with a neck profile more akin to an electric. Tone will depend on wood choices but I find the sitka spruce and rosewood to have a great clarity without being overly bright.

Furch definitely worth a look alongside Eastman too... all solid wood from the blue range upwards and, if you can stretch into yellow range territory then these seem to be really high quality at a great price. The 2018 LX OM I tried at Coda was simply stunning visually and sonically.

Enjoy the search and your new instrument once you find it.

boogieman said:

I guess this thread just goes to show all people have different opinions on what’s good or not.

My 2p worth. I played dreadnaughts for years but a while back I found I struggled with my Takamine as it gave me a terrible ache in my arm. It was all to do with the position of my fretting hand when I sat with a wider body guitar. I switched over to a small bodied Martin and have never looked back. (I happen to like the sound of Martins too, to me they’re the classic sound of a good acoustic.). So, dreads definitely aren’t for everyone.

It’s going to be difficult choosing something at the moment without getting your hands on one and listening to the tone. The nearest I got to solving that problem of demoing a new guitar was listening to the clips on the Peach site. Luckily the Martin I bought from them suits me perfectly and I’d recommend Peach to anyone. You do have the luxury of sending it back under the Distance Selling rules if it doesn’t suit of course.

This is great stuff guys, I've learned a lot from this thread even if it does mean I keep changing my mind...

Thy ergonomics side does bother me, I've got to an age where things just won't bend and stretch as they used to, and I have a persistent pain in my left shoulder which I'm sure comes from playing sitting down. It's only relatively recently that I have started playing in a seated position and it still feels wrong. That, and and getting used to the relatively large body of an acoustic might be an issue, makes me think I might just have to be patient until I can get to a shop.

Teetonetal · January 2021

I am a big fan of Yamaha, Takamine and Faith. But regardless, the best thing to do with acoustics is go and try loads... I find them a much harder buy than an electric. Also get someone else to play it, so that you can hear the full sound, not just the playing position sound.

Fishboy7 · January 2021

I don’t currently own an acoustic but have been through some nice ones:

Lowden S32 – Really nicely made, but I found that ‘overtone’ rich style was the absolute opposite end of the spectrum for me tonally

Collings OM – Utterly flawless, but not massively loud, so I think OM s might be a little ‘polite’ for me

Martin HD28vs – 12 fretter with slotted headstock – this is the one that was perfect for me and I really miss

boogieman · January 2021

Teetonetal said:

I am a big fan of Yamaha, Takamine and Faith. But regardless, the best thing to do with acoustics is go and try loads... I find them a much harder buy than an electric. Also get someone else to play it, so that you can hear the full sound, not just the playing position sound.

It’s funny, although I’ve owned a Takamine I’ve rarely heard one that I like the sound of. Mine was an all solid wood model (F370SS) with no electronics, so a very different sounding beast to most Tak’s. The SS range wasn’t a great success for Takamine apparently and they dropped both models after only a couple of years. Probably too far away from what most people expected from the brand.

Amplified Tak’s always sound too thin, processed and jangly to me, same with Taylor’s. People obviously like both makes as they sell by the shedload, but they’re not to my taste at all.

p90fool · January 2021

meltedbuzzbox said:

BingMan said:

Guess it all depends on how you define 'decent'
The tone of an acoustic is incredible subjective so these topics always turn into what other members like... which isn't to say that you'll like the same thing.

I'd start by listening to what sort of music you like, and find out what artists you admire plays what.
Of course, "you can play anything on anything", as they say... but it's a starting point and maybe will give your search some direction and focus.

I could list all the top builders going... but we don't have much to go off without some idea of budget, or types of music you like to play

Do you play blues? Country? Bluegrass? Fingerstyle? Slide? OASIS?!
Is £1000 where your head is at? £2000? £3000? £10,000? pre-war Martin d28 money?!

think If anyone is going to really be able to point you in the right direction we're going to need some more to go off!

You can't pick a guitar based on type of music you play. Unless you have a real desire to sound like a carbon copy of someone else. The notes dictate what the music is, not the guitar

True, but we still all have iconic sounds in our heads which make us smile, whether we're attempting to imitate them or not.

I never get involved with "choose me a guitar" threads, especially acoustic ones.

My brother in law had a Lowden, a Taylor and a Martin D-28 a few years ago. When I tried the first two they were impressively made, balanced, good sounding guitars, but the Martin instantly sounded like loads of classic records, I loved it.

My brother in law however hated it, and sold it before I had a chance to buy it from him.

Jez6345789 · January 2021

I think it important to work out what sort of thing you want to play and build the guitar around that.
There are some fantastic bargains out there these days without going to the big brands like Taylor Martin etc.

Dont get caught up in the can only be made good in America type snobbery or some secret sauce as I have visited both Taylor and Martin factories and they are exactly that and the business model is to charge you top dollar for every possible extra. So you want scalloped bracing you need our custom or premium range or our builder's edition.

Asia has got very good in recent years at building very good quality acoustic guitars for not too much money.

I am not sure if this is still about but I bought one of these back in 2015 for £300 quid and yes the Adirondak top took a bit of playing in but it has got better and better and it certainly surpasses most Martins and Taylors costing 6-10 times as much.

https://www.pegheadnation.com/instruments-gear/instrument-demos/cort-l300v/

munckee · January 2021

I had settled on buying a Martin junior for a smaller guitar I could play at home but also electrics if I wanted it after trying a lot of acoustics out.

A guild westerly 140 om came up near me used and I played that and instantly bought it. They are made in China but all sold woods and bone nut and saddle. I like it both strumming and with my laughable finger picking attempts.

They go for £7-800 new and seem a lot of guitar for the money. I haven’t considered any other acoustic since buying it.

Lebarque · January 2021

I've got a battle-scarred, mid-70's Guild D25 that I snagged from a mate on the cheap. It's no looker, but sounds fantastic. Apparently they have a good rep. Anyway, I guess my message is don't overlook a used instrument that has been played in and loved. There are bargains out there which sound amazing.

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Going unplugged but I've never had a decent accoustic - suggestions..?

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