Bog Oak for Acoustic guitars - Is it any good?

MichaelWatts · November 2020

Hello everyone

I recently uploaded this video featuring a bog oak instrument by Jamie Swannell out in Ely

https://youtu.be/t66uJfmf8Fc

It seems that bog oak is becoming increasingly popular as a back and sides wood in the hands of British luthiers so I made an accompanying introduction video for this cool and unusual wood - I hope you enjoy it!

https://youtu.be/lthVo5U8BCY

All the best

Michael

brucegill · November 2020

Will check this out later!

Have a Bog Oak / Lutz spruce Lowden F35. Love it. Deep base and very rich, the lutz is good to and very dynamic. Looks amazing too

WindmillGuitars · November 2020

It's a stunning combination. I have a Bog Oak back and sides jumbo (aka "The Bard") crafted by Balazs Prohaszka (Master builder at Avalon) in stock at the moment and it has incredible tone and feel to it

Epsilon · November 2020

The sustain on that Swannel is unreal. Sounds almost like it is running through a compressor.

I tried out a nice bog oak Lowden but settled on Redwood/Rosewood in the end.

GTC · November 2020

I have a sinker redwood top, bog oak back and sides Avalon S 12 fretter - fantastic guitar with beautiful resonance, timbre and sustain which seems to get better each time I pick it up. Bog oak is a very dense wood with a lovely appearance - and is very heavy (weight-wise) compared with other tonewoods. It usually carries a premium price.

ToneControl · November 2020

WindmillGuitars said:

It's a stunning combination. I have a Bog Oak back and sides jumbo (aka "The Bard") crafted by Balazs Prohaszka (Master builder at Avalon) in stock at the moment and it has incredible tone and feel to it

wow, looks amazing
I have some Avalons he has made, excellent quality instruments

Mudcrutch · November 2020

Ben at Crimson guitars builds some great bog wood guitars.

ToneControl · November 2020

@MichaelWatts - have you visited any of the Northern Ireland luthiers?

MichaelWatts · December 2020

Epsilon said:

The sustain on that Swannel is unreal. Sounds almost like it is running through a compressor.

I promise it's not! Glad you enjoyed the video though, thank you for watching!

MichaelWatts · December 2020

ToneControl said:

@MichaelWatts - have you visited any of the Northern Ireland luthiers?

Not yet! But I'm looking forward to getting over there as soon as possible!

ToneControl · December 2020

Can I ask how long you keep your nails, and how much do you use them when playing?

MichaelWatts · December 2020

Yes indeed - I'm actually working on a video on that topic and will share here when it's ready!

ToneControl · December 2020

MichaelWatts said:

Yes indeed - I'm actually working on a video on that topic and will share here when it's ready!

Excellent, share some nail maintenance tips please

drofluf · December 2020

ToneControl said:

MichaelWatts said:

Yes indeed - I'm actually working on a video on that topic and will share here when it's ready!

Excellent, share some nail maintenance tips please

This place is in danger of turning into mumsnet

ToneControl · December 2020

drofluf said:

ToneControl said:

MichaelWatts said:

Yes indeed - I'm actually working on a video on that topic and will share here when it's ready!

Excellent, share some nail maintenance tips please

This place is in danger of turning into mumsnet

In my house I've called it guitarmums for years

Moleman · December 2020

I’m pretty sure that Irish luthier, Chris Larkin was using Bog Oak in his electric instruments way back in the 1980’s.

GRBaldwin · January 2021

I've got an Avalon A7-Oak custom in Bog Oak with a Sinker Redwood top and it's delicious!

Image: https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/plugins/EmojiExtender/emoji/fb/1.gif

The Sinker has taken a while to open up I've gotta say and with it being just less than a year old I think it'll open up more, but it's definitely sounding pretty sweet at the moment anyway. It's got quite a vintage'y wooden tone to my ears, almost like a Mahogany with more upper harmonic content going on. Anyway, that's probably nonsense talk but It's a great guitar is what I'm trying to get across.

Moominpapa · January 2021

@GRBaldwin ; Holy cow - that's a looker!

GRBaldwin · January 2021

Moominpapa said:

@GRBaldwin ; Holy cow - that's a looker!

You're not wrong! Avalon make incredible guitars and are seriously underrated. They're still small so it's a really personal experience that you get and they can customise like no other company of that ilk. Balázs Prohaszkha is definitely one of the top luthiers in the whole of the world in my opinion. His customised carving and inlay work if you wanted it doing is insane!

DavidR · January 2021

Can anyone tell us about the specific characteristics of bog oak. I get it's old wood that's been submerged but how is it good? Also that it looks very very nice.

Not being negative but just want to know. How e.g. is it better tonally than heat treated/torrefied spruce? Woodier? Brighter? different? And, if so, in what way.

ToneControl · January 2021

DavidR said:

Can anyone tell us about the specific characteristics of bog oak. I get it's old wood that's been submerged but how is it good? Also that it looks very very nice.

Not being negative but just want to know. How e.g. is it better tonally than heat treated/torrefied spruce? Woodier? Brighter? different? And, if so, in what way.

it's back and sides wood, to be compared with Rosewoods AFAIK

GTC · January 2021

DavidR said:

Can anyone tell us about the specific characteristics of bog oak. I get it's old wood that's been submerged but how is it good? Also that it looks very very nice.

Not being negative but just want to know. How e.g. is it better tonally than heat treated/torrefied spruce? Woodier? Brighter? different? And, if so, in what way.

It is heavier and denser than most other back and sides woods - which give it excellent properties for tonal reflection inside guitar bodies. It works particularly well with a sinker redwood top on my Avalon S7 OAK. I've never heard or played a similar sinker redwood topped instrument with, say, rosewood back and sides - but with these properties I would expect it to give a louder, more complex tone. All I can say for sure is that my Avalon S7 is superb. I've never come across another guitar like it and it seems to get better each time I pick it up.

Gassage · January 2021

Had a Gibson Les Paul made from it- just bog standard tones really...

JCA2550 · January 2021

A good friend of mine had a LPDC shaped, through-neck solid body from Chris Larkin in the early 80s. The neck and body were made up from laminated maple, pear and bog oak, it played well, sounded adequate and weighed around 13lbs. He adored it, I thought it was a pig.

GTC · January 2021

What makes a good body wood for a solid-body electric is very different to what makes a good back and sides wood for an acoustic

malcolmkindness · January 2021

DavidR said:

Can anyone tell us about the specific characteristics of bog oak. I get it's old wood that's been submerged but how is it good? Also that it looks very very nice.

Not being negative but just want to know. How e.g. is it better tonally than heat treated/torrefied spruce? Woodier? Brighter? different? And, if so, in what way.

I have only played one bog oak/sinker redwood guitar by a well respected builder, but I thought it was very dull sounding. The cocobolo/spruce one I compared it to was much better and a lot cheaper. Maybe it was just a bad example, but it didn't impress me at all.

GTC · January 2021

malcolmkindness said:

DavidR said:

Can anyone tell us about the specific characteristics of bog oak. I get it's old wood that's been submerged but how is it good? Also that it looks very very nice.

Not being negative but just want to know. How e.g. is it better tonally than heat treated/torrefied spruce? Woodier? Brighter? different? And, if so, in what way.

I have only played one bog oak/sinker redwood guitar by a well respected builder, but I thought it was very dull sounding. The cocobolo/spruce one I compared it to was much better and a lot cheaper. Maybe it was just a bad example, but it didn't impress me at all.

I don't know if the one you played was new - but it is worth bearing in mind that sinker redwoood tops are notorious for taking ages to break in compared to spruce and cedar. But - when they do - I would say combine the mellowness and deepness of mahogany with the sparkle of spruce - it is rather wonderful and different.

My Avalon sounded pretty good from the outset - but it has gradually been getting even better as it has opened up over the past 18 months

malcolmkindness · January 2021

GTC said:

malcolmkindness said:

DavidR said:

Can anyone tell us about the specific characteristics of bog oak. I get it's old wood that's been submerged but how is it good? Also that it looks very very nice.

Not being negative but just want to know. How e.g. is it better tonally than heat treated/torrefied spruce? Woodier? Brighter? different? And, if so, in what way.

I have only played one bog oak/sinker redwood guitar by a well respected builder, but I thought it was very dull sounding. The cocobolo/spruce one I compared it to was much better and a lot cheaper. Maybe it was just a bad example, but it didn't impress me at all.

I don't know if the one you played was new - but it is worth bearing in mind that sinker redwoood tops are notorious for taking ages to break in compared to spruce and cedar. But - when they do - I would say combine the mellowness and deepness of mahogany with the sparkle of spruce - it is rather wonderful and different.

My Avalon sounded pretty good from the outset - but it has gradually been getting even better as it has opened up over the past 18 months

Yes, it was new and it might have been the sinker redwood top, but I still found it dull and uninspiring.

GRBaldwin · January 2021

GTC said:

malcolmkindness said:

DavidR said:

Can anyone tell us about the specific characteristics of bog oak. I get it's old wood that's been submerged but how is it good? Also that it looks very very nice.

Not being negative but just want to know. How e.g. is it better tonally than heat treated/torrefied spruce? Woodier? Brighter? different? And, if so, in what way.

I have only played one bog oak/sinker redwood guitar by a well respected builder, but I thought it was very dull sounding. The cocobolo/spruce one I compared it to was much better and a lot cheaper. Maybe it was just a bad example, but it didn't impress me at all.

I don't know if the one you played was new - but it is worth bearing in mind that sinker redwoood tops are notorious for taking ages to break in compared to spruce and cedar. But - when they do - I would say combine the mellowness and deepness of mahogany with the sparkle of spruce - it is rather wonderful and different.

My Avalon sounded pretty good from the outset - but it has gradually been getting even better as it has opened up over the past 18 months

@GTC I 100% agree with you here. I have a Sinker Redwood top'd Bog Oak B&S Avalon Auditorium custom guitar and had exactly the same thoughts on the Sinker.

I got it home the first day after waiting a good 10-12 weeks for it to be made, salivating with each more than appreciated update from Steve Mcilwrath along the way. May I add that it was over Christmas, so it would normally be a quicker turnaround. Anyway, I digress. I got it home and was not deflated, but disappointed is more the word. It sounded good, but a little like as if someone was squeezing it and it couldn't sing at full potential. I did read that sinker takes a while to open up, so I made it my goal to play it more than any of my other guitars and at just less than a year old now it sounds awesome!

As I mentioned above, with this combo, the guitar sounds to me a little Mahogany esque but with some super sparkly top end presence. I don't know whether the Bog Oak is providing that, but either way it's lovely. It has a really nice vintage tone to it, but one that has real presence and focus to it. The lows aren't crazy, but they're deep enough for me and I think it would work really well as a recording guitar. A bit like Mahogany in that respect.

Mine is less than a year old as I've mentioned, so, if what @GTC says is right with his and without trying to sound cheesy, It's got a little bit more of it's voice to show and I'm looking forward to hearing it.

My two penneth worth on Bog Oak for you there, haha.

DavidR · January 2021

Those are very interesting replies.

GTC · January 2021

I've mainly been playing nylon-strung guitars over the past 6 months so my Avalon A7 Sinker Redwood / Bog Oak may be taking longer than usual to open up as it only gets occasional use

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Bog Oak for Acoustic guitars - Is it any good?

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