Lower Bout Sizes?

guitarjack66 · February 2023

I'm about to sell my Grand Auditorium( Not sure whether to list it here or not because I have no packaging materials due to Mrs Jack wanting all our 'rubbish' thrown out!) because it's still too large for my needs. I had no idea the lower bout was almost the same width as a standard dreadnought. I live and learn. Anyhow,the money from the (hopefully!) sale will go towards a smaller bodied guitar from Parlour(UK spelling) Concert,OM,000,etc. So my question is 'What size are their respective lower bouts?' Shorter scale and wide necks are also a plus but 'tone' is not really a consideration here,comfort is more important as my playing level is nowhere near the level I feel it should be and I am certain this is because I still haven't found a comfortable sized guitar.
Feel free to offer advice my fellow fretboarders.

bertie · February 2023

OM is pretty much a GA - the main difference from an OM to a Dread, is the body depth, makes it (for some, including me) much more comfortable to play, without losing "too much" bass response (tho some will now come on and argue the opposite

)

Toms_Dad · February 2023

I did some research on this a little while ago before buying my current acoustic (An Atkin O37S with which I am very pleased). They vary a bit from maker to maker, but 12 series Taylor (Grand Concert) is about the same size as 000 Martin at about 15". 00's tend to be about 14.5" and 0's a bit smaller still.
I don't notice any lack of tone from a smaller guitar when I fingerpick, and it certainly beats the feeling of hugging a wardrobe. I also prefer 12 frets to the body. The extra clearance has no relevance for me when I am fingerpicking or playing chord melody stuff.
Be also aware that depth is quite important too. I have no problem with a 16" thin-line guitar such as a ES330.

guitarjack66 · February 2023

Toms_Dad said:

I did some research on this a little while ago before buying my current acoustic (An Atkin O37S with which I am very pleased). They vary a bit from maker to maker, but 12 series Taylor (Grand Concert) is about the same size as 000 Martin at about 15". 00's tend to be about 14.5" and 0's a bit smaller still.
I don't notice any lack of tone from a smaller guitar when I fingerpick, and it certainly beats the feeling of hugging a wardrobe. I also prefer 12 frets to the body. The extra clearance has no relevance for me when I am fingerpicking or playing chord melody stuff.
Be also aware that depth is quite important too. I have no problem with a 16" thin-line guitar such as a ES330.

Thank's TomsDad. Depth is something I have would prefer less of too.

guitarjack66 · February 2023

bertie said:

OM is pretty much a GA - the main difference from an OM to a Dread, is the body depth, makes it (for some, including me) much more comfortable to play, without losing "too much" bass response (tho some will now come on and argue the opposite )

If that is the case then an OM is out of the equation too.

Tannin · February 2023

Everybody does their own thing.

Martin's sizes are as follows:

* 0 344mm

* 00 364mm

* 000 and OM 380mm

* Dreadnought 400mm

* Jumbo 406mm (aka "Medium jumbo".)

Grand auditorium guitars are roughly around about 000 size. Jumbos can be 25mm smaller than that "small jumbo" or 25mm bigger. Most "concert" size guitars are similar to a 00, or sometimes an 0. Auditorium size is somewhere in between 0 and 000 - your guess is as good as mine exactly where.

Parlours are smaller than that - say 320mm and under.

But there is no real standardisation. You can call anything you want anything you like and somewhere in the world you can be certain that someone will.

drofluf · February 2023

As others have commented there’s no such think as a standard but here’s Brook’s take on it https://www.brookguitars.com/guitar-specifications-and-prices/

Mellish · February 2023

The Martin OM has a 15" lower bout and 4" body depth. May not sound a lot but it's enough to still give you a good bass response.

After more than 50 years of playing dreads, I found I could no longer do it. I'd go home after a gig knowing I'd get the mother of all shoulder aches next day.

So I did what some here suggested: I p/e'd the dread and got myself this Martin OM-28 Re-imagined. No more shoulder ache, and I can play it all day.

guitarjack66 · February 2023

Looks like Concert or 00 are my best bets.

BluesLover · February 2023

Try a Taylor GS mini

guitarjack66 · February 2023

BluesLover said:

Try a Taylor GS mini

What size are they equivalent to? What is the neck like,wide,narrow?

Mellish · February 2023

@guitarjack66 ;

The GS Mini has a Grand Symphony body size.

guitarjack66 · February 2023

Mellish said:

@guitarjack66 ;

The GS Mini has a Grand Symphony body size.

Grand Symphony? Another new one on me!

BluesLover · February 2023

The GS mini is a scaled down Grand Symphony body. Body width 36.5cm, depth max 10cm, length 45 cm. Scale length 24 inches. I see it as a modern parlour guitar.

stickyfiddle · February 2023

00 size sounds like it would fit well (no pun intended!).

I have an Atkin 47 which I adore - that's quoted as 4.5" deep and 14.5" wide, so very similar - that's based on a Gibson LG-2 so those might be worth a look too.

guitarjack66 · February 2023

BluesLover said:

The GS mini is a scaled down Grand Symphony body. Body width 36.5cm, depth max 10cm, length 45 cm. Scale length 24 inches. I see it as a modern parlour guitar.

Lower Bout?

BluesLover · February 2023

I've just measured my guitar as it's hanging on the wall next to me. Body width above is measured across lower bout. https://www.taylorguitars.com/guitars/acoustic/features/shapes

bertie · February 2023

guitarjack66 said:

BluesLover said:

The GS mini is a scaled down Grand Symphony body. Body width 36.5cm, depth max 10cm, length 45 cm. Scale length 24 inches. I see it as a modern parlour guitar.

Lower Bout?

Id assume its "body width" cos if thats the upper bout, its a double bass

Devil#20 · February 2023

I suggest you get down to PMT or somewhere with a good wall selection of Martins and Taylors. Some of them aren't much bigger than a ukulele. I was looking at them in PMT in Salford this morning. Tiny little things.

Your GA is like a cross between a dreadnought and an OM. Bout size is same as a dreadnought but it's narrower at the sound hole like the OM or OOO. The GA is probably the most versatile acoustic but the OM is now the most popular size bought. I think if you find the GA too big the OM will probably be ideal. I wouldn't be looking at a Taylor or Martin though. I'd look at the Eastman OM range. Superb hand made guitars that, pound for pound, are far better value.

goldtop · February 2023

Does this help? It's c-n-p from my research spreadsheet, no idea what the forum softeware will do to the formatting, here goes:

Sigma J45	15 7/8 402mm

Yamaha LS-TA	14 15/16 380mm
Yamaha AC3R	14 15/16 380mm

Taylor Academy 12e	15 381mm
Taylor GC	15 381mm
Martin SC10e	15.5 390
Yamaha FS-TA	14 15/16 380mm
Vintage V300	15 381mm

Martin OM/000	15 381mm
Taylor GTe	15 381mm
Faith Venus	385
Furch OM	378
Taylor GS Mini	14 3/8 365mm
Martin DJr	14 1/8 359mm
Martin 00	14.3 364mm
Furch 00M	358
Eastman E20P	13 3/4 350mm

Martin 0	13 1/2 344mm
Yamaha CSF-TA	13 7/16 340mm
Martin 000Jr	14 356mm

Martin Backpacker	8 203mm

guitarjack66 · February 2023

Nice work @goldtop. I will have to measure my GA tomorrow. My guess is 15 to 16 inches.

drofluf · February 2023

@guitarjack66 don't get hung up on the numbers; when I went to Brook I’d done my homework with the numbers - I had a complicated spreadsheet where I’d averaged and weighted what I thought were the important factors - and “knew” that I wanted a Clyst: their ‘O’ size but when I tried a few it was a Lyn, the “next size up” that felt right. So go out and play a few before you commit

guitarjack66 · February 2023

drofluf said:

@guitarjack66 don't get hung up on the numbers; when I went to Brook I’d done my homework with the numbers - I had a complicated spreadsheet where I’d averaged and weighted what I thought were the important factors - and “knew” that I wanted a Clyst: their ‘O’ size but when I tried a few it was a Lyn, the “next size up” that felt right. So go out and play a few before you commit

There is nowhere to try anything near where I live,like many others.

Tannin · February 2023

guitarjack66 said:

There is nowhere to try anything near where I live,like many others.

So go somewhere else. Half the damn membership of the Fretboard spends half its time sitting at home pretending that trains, busses, cars, bicycles, taxis, aeroplanes and tardises don't exist.

guitarjack66 · February 2023

Tannin said:

guitarjack66 said:

There is nowhere to try anything near where I live,like many others.

So go somewhere else. Half the damn membership of the Fretboard spends half its time sitting at home pretending that trains, busses, cars, bicycles, taxis, aeroplanes and tardises don't exist.

The cost of leaving your home in any kind of transport is mind blowing, while sitting in a cold,damp British home and contemplating heating it is yet another mind blowing exercise. Before you say that from Tasmania please consider the pricey hellhole the UK has become for many over here.

Mellish · February 2023

For me, say I want to go to GG Birmingham (I consider that my nearest, good store), I'm almost forced to go by way of a taxi cos I'm partially sighted. £180 just for that. It's why I don't go often!.

I *do* get there...you know, a large jar, a bit of change in now and then, soon builds up and that's my fare money. Just the way *I* do it.

guitarjack66 · February 2023

Mellish said:

For me, say I want to go to GG Birmingham (I consider that my nearest, good store), I'm almost forced to go by way of a taxi cos I'm partially sighted. £180 just for that. It's why I don't go often!.

I *do* get there...you know, a large jar, a bit of change in now and then, soon builds up and that's my fare money. Just the way *I* do it.

When I shop in person I buy used at a local used shop local to me which has some really good second hand instruments but he doesnt have good stuff,relatively speaking,in for long. I also have Frailers but their selection is limited on the budget side and bloody expensive in all honesty. Probably due to the fact it has little competition for miles around. I will have to sell first but I am dreading the price I will get,and fees,on ebay. As I said,I cant transport it so it will be pick up only.

Mellish · February 2023

@guitarjack66 ; being out in the wilds with not much spare cash and going on a road trip teaches you a lesson that will serve you well: don't mess up cos your spare cash has gone and you can't go back.

Tannin · February 2023

Mate, I am about to spend a week travelling around the UK, mostly by train. Cost per mile is higher in the UK, but cost to go from one major centre to another major centre in the same country is lower for you that it is for me here in Oz.

Meanwhile, I see a nice little Taylor GS Mini in Bath/Bristol is listed in the classifieds. (No idea where you are, just thought I'd mention it.)

Mellish · February 2023

@Tannin ; at a push, he says he'll post.

There's more pics up, and he says it's "immaculate". Wouldn't surprise me to learn at some point that an Aussie took it back to Oz!

Tannin · February 2023

Not going to happen mate. I've played GS Minis and been blown away by how good they are for such a small, cheap guitar. Really something special. Punch well above their weight. A year or two ago I went on a binge shopping for a quiet guitar to play in the evenings without annoying Mrs Tannin too much, and tried everything from hollow body electrics not plugged in to Baby Taylors and various others. The GS Mini tempted me a bit, but I have never liked short scales and that one is shorter than most - under 600mm.

But for anyone who doesn't mind a short scale, I reckon they are good stuff. (And do you know how much it would cost me to cart it home on an aeroplane? Probably cheaper to throw it in the Thames and buy another one back home in Hobart. International shipping can be quite reasonable, but airlines reckon anyone with an extra bag can be (and should be!) bled white.

(And yes, I do plan to pick up a guitar while I'm over

but I'll have it shipped to me with DHL or FedEx or someone. I'll start a NGD thread for that shortly.)

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