Anyone ever played or owned an all-Koa guitar?

ToneControl · June 2020

I've played lap steel ones, but never a steel-strung acoustic

youtube Demos sound lovely to me, I like to play fingerstyle - usually prefer cedar or redwood top, with good rosewood B+S, or ziricote

Koa · June 2020

Yes, Koa’s a really great tone wood. A touch brighter than mahogany but fantastic clarity and warmth. My current fave is a Gibson Hummingbird Koa though,with spruce top Koa back and sides.

Jez6345789 · June 2020

I love Koa in all things wood and guitars my biggest buying regret was not having 5 k to drop when Martin did the ooo28 Koa back in 2014.

i had loan of my friends for three months whilst he was working away and although quiet constricted to start with you just get a very mid range sound out the box they do develop an almost piano like ring and very sweet top notes.

i would still love to own one or even get a nice solid Koa guitar but funds still allude me.

as much as it’s pretty rare wood these days I would happily have every guitar I own made of koa lol

malcolmkindness · June 2020

I have a Martin 00028k 1921 authentic. I was on a visit to TFOA in 2015 and although I certainly didn't need another guitar I just couldn't resist it. Beautiful to look at, a wide nut and a deliciously warm tone.

Redlester · June 2020

A good friend of mine has the Taylor GS Mini Koa and it’s his main gigging guitar.

I’ve got the mahogany one, but it’s been a while since I’ve played with him so I can’t really remember what- if any- tonal differences there were.

But on looks alone Koa guitars are well worth checking out.

You mention cedar tops. They tend to be quite mellow don’t they? At least my cedar topped dreadnought is. I think maybe Koa has a little but more ‘top’ than cedar.

westford · June 2020

I’ve got a Tanglewood mini e Koa and really like it. Went shopping for a spruce top and came home with that instead.

artiebear · June 2020

Both my Koa guitars have spruce tops, a Gibson 185 custom and a Collings OM2H. In that combo, Koa works really well, especially for recording being a bit drier and more direct sounding than rosewood. The only all Koa I had regular access to was also a Collings. Visually, like all Koa, you want to fall in love with it. Practically, one the other hand, I found that with newish strings it was a choir of sweet angels, but there was a real drop off in harmonic breadth and general liveliness as the strings got played in, probably just down to the midrange push that koa has as opposed to the way spruce deals with higher frequencies..
It is still one of the most beautiful woods around aesthetically.

Wazmeister · June 2020

Ive played and owned a Koa Taylor, and aside from the great looks, it had a full sound, very balanced and warm.

ToneControl · June 2020

@MichaelWatts you had a video of a Koa guitar on AGF that is no longer available
Can you help please?

boogieman · June 2020

I had a Takamine F370 dreadnaught till recently (now gone to my stepson) koa back and sides but with a spruce top. It didn’t sound as full in the bass as a mahogany guitar but it had a nice all round tone with a quite zingy top end. Koa is a lovely wood to look at, very warm colour with nice figuring. There’s some pics in my ad. https://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/181903/withdrawn-takamine-f370ss-dreadnought#latest

10thumbs · June 2020

I have an all Koa GS Mini (obviously the back and sides are laminated ) , and I love it , the tone is excellent, as previously stated , like a mahogany but clearer and with more top end , good fingerpicking tone.
I can thoroughly recommend them.
And it also looks great , pic on the "new prs parlour leaked " thread , next page , obviously it's the middle one , lol.

guitargeek62 · June 2020

I had an-all Koa Taylor for a while, it was a lovely instrument but a touch too bright for my tastes. However, it should be said that I tend to prefer short-scale slope-shouldered dreadnoughts, so that probably explains half of it!

zepp76 · June 2020

westford said:

I’ve got a Tanglewood mini e Koa and really like it. Went shopping for a spruce top and came home with that instead.

I love my Tanglewood, there seems to be a snooty attitude towards them as a brand but they make fantastic acoustics.

MichaelWatts · June 2020

ToneControl said:

@MichaelWatts you had a video of a Koa guitar on AGF that is no longer available
Can you help please?

Hi there!

Yes I've played a number of koa guitars and it's one of my favourite woods under the right circumstances. I have a soft spot for 1920's koa Martins (the little 12 fret numbers) and I've found it very effective when twinned with good Adirondack or German spruce. I'm not sure which video you're referring to as I did quite a few with Koa instruments - I can say that the content I produced for that company has since been removed.

So much depends on the maker in question and the design of the instrument itself. Some are just big ukuleles, some are really special!

All the best

Michael

GTC · June 2020

I had a Spruce / koa Brook Tamar. Lovely guitar to play, the koa looked fantastic. Tonewise it was best described as very direct with good articulation and tonal separation from the individual strings which made it excellent for solo work. It tended towards the trebley end on all strings.

My only experience of an all-koa guitar was, like others, the Taylor GS-Mini which has a solid koa top and laminate koa back and sides. It also looked fantastic but, like other Taylor guitars (apart from the T5z hybrid) I've had, somewhat underwhelming.

I've tried several all-solid koa and acacia (similar) ukes and it does add something to those.

ToneControl · June 2020

I've ordered a custom-made all-koa guitar, watch this space

artiebear · June 2020

ToneControl said:

I've ordered a custom-made all-koa guitar, watch this space

Interesting, looking forward to the NGD.

CloudNine · June 2020

I have heard that of all the woods, Koa is the one to try before you buy.. Apparently some absolute duds, quite tight sounding and apparently does not change much from day one in terms of the top opening up in tone, which I suppose may be more expected as a hard wood. Not really sure that is true though. Also remember reading that the less figured stuff sounds significantly better.

My own personal (very limited) experience with Koa was however, very good. Not the full Koa build, but I did have a Koa/Redwood Lowden F50, which was a lovely thing. Not really my style of guitar ultimately, but a very good one nonetheless. Played a Koa Martin which was also great in its own way, although would not want it as my only guitar.

I have had custom built acoustics and would personally not risk a Koa top, but hopefully it will be amazing. No guts, no glory! Spruce is just so amazingly consistent as a top wood though, and definitely improves over time. I have found Adirondack to be amazing. All the very best guitars I have played, have been Adi, it can be warm, bright, whatever, depending on the builder, but it always has a sense of power available when required. Like driving a car with a big engine.

artiebear · June 2020

CloudNine said:

I have heard that of all the woods, Koa is the one to try before you buy.. Apparently some absolute duds, quite tight sounding and apparently does not change much from day one in terms of the top opening up in tone, which I suppose may be more expected as a hard wood. Not really sure that is true though. Also remember reading that the less figured stuff sounds significantly better.

My own personal (very limited) experience with Koa was however, very good. Not the full Koa build, but I did have a Koa/Redwood Lowden F50, which was a lovely thing. Not really my style of guitar ultimately, but a very good one nonetheless. Played a Koa Martin which was also great in its own way, although would not want it as my only guitar.

I have had custom built acoustics and would personally not risk a Koa top, but hopefully it will be amazing. No guts, no glory! Spruce is just so amazingly consistent as a top wood though, and definitely improves over time. I have found Adirondack to be amazing. All the very best guitars I have played, have been Adi, it can be warm, bright, whatever, depending on the builder, but it always has a sense of power available when required. Like driving a car with a big engine.

As far as Koa goes, you're right. As as Acacia, it is very variable in terms of the way it responds. The older stuff ( totally harvested out due to it's higher altitude growth ) tends to be more conducive to good wide frequency resonance. A lot of wood is now being taken from lower trees ( different climatic conditions ). One weird thing with my Koa guitars is that it does seem that if I haven't used them for a while, they seem to take more warming up ( could just be my ear, but I have a Macassar Ebony Bourgeois that behaves in a similar way, nothing to do with new strings etc. ) .

You sum up adirondack very well indeed. There is loads of power under the hood, but it still purrs nicely in first gear.

earwighoney · June 2020

ToneControl said:

I've ordered a custom-made all-koa guitar, watch this space

Fine work. Who's the maker?

CloudNine said:

I have heard that of all the woods, Koa is the one to try before you buy.. Apparently some absolute duds, quite tight sounding and apparently does not change much from day one in terms of the top opening up in tone, which I suppose may be more expected as a hard wood. Not really sure that is true though. Also remember reading that the less figured stuff sounds significantly better.

The top statement is in line with something I picked up from the AGF a while back with a few luthiers suggesting some Koa soundboards can look spectacular but sound less than great and it seems in line with other things by luthiers I have read where they'd say visual appearance of a soundboard isn't as important as stiffness and mass.

Some of the 1920's-30's Martin Koas used very plain looking soundboards and sounded truly superb.

ToneControl · June 2020

earwighoney said:

ToneControl said:

I've ordered a custom-made all-koa guitar, watch this space

Fine work. Who's the maker?

CloudNine said:

I have heard that of all the woods, Koa is the one to try before you buy.. Apparently some absolute duds, quite tight sounding and apparently does not change much from day one in terms of the top opening up in tone, which I suppose may be more expected as a hard wood. Not really sure that is true though. Also remember reading that the less figured stuff sounds significantly better.

The top statement is in line with something I picked up from the AGF a while back with a few luthiers suggesting some Koa soundboards can look spectacular but sound less than great and it seems in line with other things by luthiers I have read where they'd say visual appearance of a soundboard isn't as important as stiffness and mass.

Some of the 1920's-30's Martin Koas used very plain looking soundboards and sounded truly superb.

Avalon
their most expert luthier has tap-tested and inspected the wood, so I am confident it's not going to be a dud

I stood with them whilst they tested the sinker redwood pieces, they definitely know how to pick out the best sounding wood

ToneControl · June 2020

artiebear said:

CloudNine said:

I have heard that of all the woods, Koa is the one to try before you buy.. Apparently some absolute duds, quite tight sounding and apparently does not change much from day one in terms of the top opening up in tone, which I suppose may be more expected as a hard wood. Not really sure that is true though. Also remember reading that the less figured stuff sounds significantly better.

My own personal (very limited) experience with Koa was however, very good. Not the full Koa build, but I did have a Koa/Redwood Lowden F50, which was a lovely thing. Not really my style of guitar ultimately, but a very good one nonetheless. Played a Koa Martin which was also great in its own way, although would not want it as my only guitar.

I have had custom built acoustics and would personally not risk a Koa top, but hopefully it will be amazing. No guts, no glory! Spruce is just so amazingly consistent as a top wood though, and definitely improves over time. I have found Adirondack to be amazing. All the very best guitars I have played, have been Adi, it can be warm, bright, whatever, depending on the builder, but it always has a sense of power available when required. Like driving a car with a big engine.

As far as Koa goes, you're right. As as Acacia, it is very variable in terms of the way it responds. The older stuff ( totally harvested out due to it's higher altitude growth ) tends to be more conducive to good wide frequency resonance. A lot of wood is now being taken from lower trees ( different climatic conditions ). One weird thing with my Koa guitars is that it does seem that if I haven't used them for a while, they seem to take more warming up ( could just be my ear, but I have a Macassar Ebony Bourgeois that behaves in a similar way, nothing to do with new strings etc. ) .

You sum up adirondack very well indeed. There is loads of power under the hood, but it still purrs nicely in first gear.

I have this with my Adi top dread. Quite common with stiffer woods I believe

GTC · June 2020

ToneControl said:

I've ordered a custom-made all-koa guitar, watch this space

Brave - but very interesting. Would be interested to hear how it goes but, from my own experiences, would have a lot of faith in the Avalon guys to pick out a great set for you.

earwighoney · June 2020

ToneControl said:

Avalon
their most expert luthier has tap-tested and inspected the wood, so I am confident it's not going to be a dud

I stood with them whilst they tested the sinker redwood pieces, they definitely know how to pick out the best sounding wood

Cheers for the info. I've not tried one but they have a great reputation.

What body size are you going for?

ToneControl · June 2020

earwighoney said:

ToneControl said:

Avalon
their most expert luthier has tap-tested and inspected the wood, so I am confident it's not going to be a dud

I stood with them whilst they tested the sinker redwood pieces, they definitely know how to pick out the best sounding wood

Cheers for the info. I've not tried one but they have a great reputation.

What body size are you going for?

Jumbo

shufflebeat · June 2020

I went out to buy a left handed Takamine dreadnought and almost bought a right handed Takamine ef407 parlour. It was the most beautiful sounding and feeling guitar I've played in years, both acoustic and amplified.

Phil_C · June 2020

No but I'd love an all Koa Taylor.

Though I can't seem to prise myself away from my Takamine

GTC · June 2020

I can't get the thought of something with a Koa top and Macassar Ebony back and sides out of my mind - a sort of pimped up redwood / bog oak.

WindmillGuitars · June 2020

@ToneControl The Robin Thompson (Avalon/Lowden) I had listed ages ago on here was all Tasmanian Blackwood which is very Koa like - tone was incredible.

ToneControl · June 2020

WindmillGuitars said:

@ToneControl The Robin Thompson (Avalon/Lowden) I had listed ages ago on here was all Tasmanian Blackwood which is very Koa like - tone was incredible.

looks great, Stevie mentioned that it was similar to Koa
Mine will be a 12 fret jumbo with a Florentine cutaway

WindmillGuitars · June 2020

That'll be very nice @ToneControl - hoping to catch up with Stevie soon myself

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Anyone ever played or owned an all-Koa guitar?

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