Buying Vinyl. New or Old?

JezWynd · September 2023

Is there any advantage qualitatively in old rather than new vinyl or is a new, recent pressing the best way to go? I've been buying a few vinyl LP's recently - a mix of old and new and I'm wondering if some new releases of old albums are sub par. I won't mention specific titles as it might be my faulty ears or system but interested if anyone else has an opinion on old vs new vinyl.

theatreanchor · September 2023

Always read the credits. Check Discogs reviews of the catalogue number of the record. There are so many different pressings. With the current vinyl boon, there are many shady represses (including from Abbey Road). I’ve been looking for early pressings of Sabbath records for years, but never found one. I wouldn’t buy a new one. I prefer older vinyl, personally though it is harder to find. You can, however, get great remasters on new vinyl done by great, reputable companies (like Mr Bongo for example). There are no firm rules. Just be wise, and wary.

strumjoughlamps · September 2023

New stuff where has the mix come from? Who knows I don't so I question that.

That said it's common knowledge that 90s vinyl is shit.. I had RIDE 'Nowhere' original and modern re issue on 180gm vinyl and the 180gm was much better.

And again, that said I find 70s original vinyl much warmer and of its time compared to modern pressings..

I would expect someone would feel different, I guess it's good we have a choice.

theatreanchor · September 2023

Plenty of good ‘90s pressings if I’m honest. ‘Entroducing’ being one. So much good hip-hop etc. Rock music not so much.

JezWynd · September 2023

strumjoughlamps said:

New stuff where has the mix come from? Who knows I don't so I question that.

That said it's common knowledge that 90s vinyl is shit.. I had RIDE 'Nowhere' original and modern re issue on 180gm vinyl and the 180gm was much better.

And again, that said I find 70s original vinyl much warmer and of its time compared to modern pressings..

I would expect someone would feel different, I guess it's good we have a choice.

That's what I've been finding too but I wasn't sure it wasn't my imagination.

theatreanchor said:

Always read the credits. Check Discogs reviews of the catalogue number of the record. There are so many different pressings. With the current vinyl boon, there are many shady represses (including from Abbey Road). I’ve been looking for early pressings of Sabbath records for years, but never found one. I wouldn’t buy a new one. I prefer older vinyl, personally though it is harder to find. You can, however, get great remasters on new vinyl done by great, reputable companies (like Mr Bongo for example). There are no firm rules. Just be wise, and wary.

I've been looking at Ummagumma recently and find, on reading reviews of the Remaster, that there are changes to the original pressing - not least that they've cut sides 3 & 4 into individual tracks where the original was one cut. And a recent pressing of Steely Dan's Countdown to Ecstasy has a weird fuzzy sound on Showbiz Kids that sounds like it's in the mix (not sure what's going on there). While old vinyl has a reassuringly familiar sound (providing you source a clean copy).

theatreanchor · September 2023

JezWynd said:

strumjoughlamps said:

New stuff where has the mix come from? Who knows I don't so I question that.

That said it's common knowledge that 90s vinyl is shit.. I had RIDE 'Nowhere' original and modern re issue on 180gm vinyl and the 180gm was much better.

And again, that said I find 70s original vinyl much warmer and of its time compared to modern pressings..

I would expect someone would feel different, I guess it's good we have a choice.

That's what I've been finding too but I wasn't sure it wasn't my imagination.

theatreanchor said:

Always read the credits. Check Discogs reviews of the catalogue number of the record. There are so many different pressings. With the current vinyl boon, there are many shady represses (including from Abbey Road). I’ve been looking for early pressings of Sabbath records for years, but never found one. I wouldn’t buy a new one. I prefer older vinyl, personally though it is harder to find. You can, however, get great remasters on new vinyl done by great, reputable companies (like Mr Bongo for example). There are no firm rules. Just be wise, and wary.

I've been looking at Ummagumma recently and find, on reading reviews of the Remaster, that there are changes to the original pressing - not least that they've cut sides 3 & 4 into individual tracks where the original was one cut. And a recent pressing of Steely Dan's Countdown to Ecstasy has a weird fuzzy sound on Showbiz Kids that sounds like it's in the mix (not sure what's going on there). While old vinyl has a reassuringly familiar sound (providing you source a clean copy).

Bought every copy of my Dan stuff at record fairs for £3 a pop (max!) Perfect condition, sounds AMAZING. I’ll check if I’ve got any spares.

blobb · September 2023

I collect loads of records from all labels. A lot are obscure folk labels which didn't have a lot of resources to pay for top level recording / mastering.

My view is that the original pressings are best (and there may be different pressings, budget releases etc...) because they were mastered at the time for the audio equipment they were expected to be played on. So called remasters don't do it for me.

However, old records wear out. As the groove wears the sound suffers. New pressings are cleaner and have full depth grooves. My ideal is an original pressing that hasn't been played much.

DavidR · September 2023

New has become expensive of late.

Also old you typically get more tracks per side. Some new LP's you can getter fewer tracks per side.

Never been quite sure why this is. Perhaps some brainy tFB person can tell me. :-)

blobb · September 2023

That's down to mastering. I've got some double disc that would have been ok on single disc but you know, re-package re-package, re-issue, a tacky badge and a photograph.

The closer together the grooves, the lesser the alleged sound quality.

mudslide73 · September 2023

Old for me. What's the point in listening to a digital mix/master on vinyl? I've been collecting the DLR VH albums from the time (not necessarily 1st or even desirable pressings) and they're incredible.

If you're at least semi serious about cleaning there's not much old stuff that you won't enjoy imo.

theatreanchor · September 2023

DavidR said:

New has become expensive of late.

Also old you typically get more tracks per side. Some new LP's you can getter fewer tracks per side.

Never been quite sure why this is. Perhaps some brainy tFB person can tell me. :-)

An LP should have max approx 21-22mins per side otherwise you end up with quiet, overly compressed records (eg 3 ft High and Rising). The reason for more sides of vinyl now is for louder, more open sounding pressings. Tone Poet (special Blue Note pressings) are a good example. And you’ll get stuff like Beastie Boys album on four sides of vinyl, or Sun Ra, or Metallica. Massive cash in.

sweepy · September 2023

Buy a decent record cleaner for a start, even new records aren't clean, they have releasing agent etc on them, use ear protection though. j/s

https://joeaudio.co.uk/products/pro-ject-vc-s3-record-cleaning-machine?variant=44093902946518&currency=GBP&utm_medium=product_sync&utm_source=google&utm_content=sag_organic&utm_campaign=sag_organic&gclid=CjwKCAjw6eWnBhAKEiwADpnw9rTQAFAH07UYh6FHENrEfCNI6th-j7_NmtZ635_kHzSKp4EGm-O95BoCqIwQAvD_BwE

roberty · September 2023

There are no rules really. I am often disappointed by the quality of new vinyl but there is some great stuff too. I have some jazz records pressed from CD masters and they sound phenomenal lol

scrumhalf · September 2023

As soon as record companies saw how much they could make from CDs they started producing poorer quality vinyl.

I had to take back at least one album in five because they either sounded like crap or they eould warp at the slightest opportunity.

Don't buy late 80s vinyl if it's too flexible.

theatreanchor · September 2023

scrumhalf said:

As soon as record companies saw how much they could make from CDs they started producing poorer quality vinyl.

I had to take back at least one album in five because they either sounded like crap or they eould warp at the slightest opportunity.

Don't buy late 80s vinyl if it's too flexible.

This is a good rule. Flippy floppy vinyl is no good to anyone.

SPECTRUM001 · September 2023

100% agree with everything above - which leads to there being very few safe bets. An early copy of Pet Sounds that wasn't over-played should be pretty good, as are my copies of The White Album (I have several 1968/9 pressings). But I also have awful copies of The Doors and Love LPs.

Noting that some of Universal's recent remastered LPs eg Iggy, The Cure, Rory are excellent.

A good example of the same is the first Psychedelic Furs album. My original 1980 issue is really tinny and horrible (still love it though !), however Sony's repress from a couple of years back is amazing. Actually, they knew it needed some work, so made an effort to do their best.

If I had to commit, I would suggest that many 70s LPs are ok, but quality deteriorates in the eighties.

Last comment - I have my late Ma's copy of Them Changes by Buddy Miles. What an album ! And the pressing is excellent - second to none, and it has been played a lot over the last fifty years, and still sounds fab.

Octavio · September 2023

Not to derail the thread but you seem like a knowledgeable lot. I inherited a load of old vinyl from the 70s.

Does anyone know of a record player with XLR or 1/4" outs? Can only find RCA

theatreanchor · September 2023

Octavio said:

Not to derail the thread but you seem like a knowledgeable lot. I inherited a load of old vinyl from the 70s.

Does anyone know of a record player with XLR or 1/4" outs? Can only find RCA

You could use a converter if you need. Amazon should have some. Or you could go from the RCA into a mixer and then use the XLR / 1/4” outs from the mixer.

richman6100 · September 2023

The 70s was a great decade for vinyl. The people producing it had been doing so for long enough to master the art and work around its inherent limitations. The technology had obviously progressed from previous decades too. It was vinyl's heyday in terms of production expertise and sales. Inevitably, there was variation in quality, but it was probably the most consistent era.

Once the 80s saw CDs take over, vinyl production skills were gradually lost, at least the number of people with these skills declined. Some 80s and 90s vinyl was pretty awful for a range of reasons. Certainly, music intended for CD was often mastered in a way that was not best suited to vinyl. Some early CDs were dreadful too to be honest.

A good pressing of a well mastered album from the 1970s *that's in excellent condition* will generally be a safe bet. Maybe not the best, but usually a great option.

Having said all this, there are some new pressings that are as good as 70s ones and sometimes better. For example, I have several pressings of Nick Drake's albums - originals and various remasters. The best of the remasters are the very best, although the less good remasters are not as good as the original 70s pressings in my opinion. I have arguably the best pressing of Kind of Blue by Miles Davis and that is a modern pressing on 200g. It's one of those vinyl records that I genuinely feel is better quality than the best digital version I have of the same album and I have a few of those too. It wasn't cheap though. Whilst I have a nostalgic love of vinyl, I'm under no illusion that vinyl always compares well to the best digital recordings and some of it is questionably expensive.

There are some good websites which review different vinyl pressings of the same album - always a good starting point.

DavidR · September 2023

Where do the good quality modern pressings come from? Is there a particular country or manufacturer which still seems on top of the medium?

viz · September 2023

I prefer to go for boxsets, limited editions and originals, rather than best quality. Probably fickle.

jonnyburgo · September 2023

Just depends, some better some not. I have an Original Born to Run that just doesn't sound good, Also have Steely Dan Aja original which sounds like you are in the room with them.
The Zappa records reissues from the late 80s/90s sound amazing.

RobDavies · September 2023

jonnyburgo said:

Just depends, some better some not. I have an Original Born to Run that just doesn't sound good, Also have Steely Dan Aja original which sounds like you are in the room with them.
The Zappa records reissues from the late 80s/90s sound amazing.

I bought a vinyl re-issue of Master Of Puppets. It’s awful and sounds like they’ve added all the bass that was missing from….And Justice For All.

It’s one of the reasons I gave up in vinyl - apart from the occasional purchase because it’s collectible, or comes with something collectible.

RobDavies · September 2023

Octavio said:

Not to derail the thread but you seem like a knowledgeable lot. I inherited a load of old vinyl from the 70s.

Does anyone know of a record player with XLR or 1/4" outs? Can only find RCA

What are you intending to plug the record player into?

Penn · September 2023

New records and old records are all of variable quality.

Some modern pressings that are cheaper are basically MP3s pressed on to LP. NotNow records for example do things like that.

Some of the 60s/70s budget pressings weren’t great. Some stuff was pressed not to have a lot of bass originally because the equipment it was played on was rubbish.

It’s all depends on the pressing not the era. The way it was mastered, the source and the condition of a record all impact the sound. There’s good and bad all round. Trying to find a good version is how I’ve ended having some records 3 or 4 times.

theatreanchor · September 2023

DavidR said:

Where do the good quality modern pressings come from? Is there a particular country or manufacturer which still seems on top of the medium?

I have certain labels / companies that I favour. Plenty of good pressing plants around the world, but because it’s such a specific process, it really depends on the whole production chain being successful.

JezWynd · September 2023

richman6100 said:

The 70s was a great decade for vinyl. The people producing it had been doing so for long enough to master the art and work around its inherent limitations. The technology had obviously progressed from previous decades too. It was vinyl's heyday in terms of production expertise and sales. Inevitably, there was variation in quality, but it was probably the most consistent era.
…

Your comments mirror my experience of buying used LPs from the 70’s. The format had been finessed to maximise the quality of analog recording techniques. The rise of digital and the switch to CD bought in a new baseline sound that seldom sounded as good to my ears, but perhaps that’s just a personal preference.

I fell back into vinyl almost by mistake. I purchased an old, refurbed mono record player to listen to a large collection of singles that I hadn’t played for over thirty years. I still had a few vinyl LPs but didn’t trust the heavy arm of the player not to damage them, so started to build a modest system a piece at a time as items presented themselves. I’m not audiophile enough to merit a high end system and am not sure my hearing is good enough now to notice the difference.

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Buying Vinyl. New or Old?

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