Newbie action question

Unorthodox · July 2014

Hey there, I got my first acoustic yesterday (Faith FVHG-HEX) from Richards Guitars.

While I was expecting the action to be fairly higher than what I'm use to with an electric, it still looks incredibly high around the 12th fret, but as this is my first acoustic I'm not sure if I was just expecting a bit too much.

Great here at the nut:-

Not so much at the 12th:

Reckon I should get it setup to trim a bit off the bridge?

ToneControl · July 2014

need to measure it really - use a steel rule from the frets and look under the string http://www.fretnotguitarrepair.com/repair/acoustic-guitar/action.php

if it were high, and the neck relief was ok, and the nut is OK, then here's how you do it

http://www.acousticguitar.com/How-To/Checking-and-Adjusting-Saddle-Height

but if you over do it, you have to make a shim

If you have any doubts at all about your likelihood of succeeding, take it to an expert

luscombe · July 2014

I find it incredibly difficult to get a good action on acoustic guitars. Like everything in life it's all about compromise, If the action is to low, the guitar will not sound too good and the strings may buzz & rattle. Too high, and it will be a pain to play. Just to compound the problem, ant changes you make on the action of an acoustic can be difficult (and expensive!) to reverse. If all this isn't enough, the construction of flat-top acoustic means the instrument is trying to pull itself apart from the moment you string it and bring it up to tune. These strains eventually make the sounboard 'belly' out, raising the strings, and therefore ruining the action you've worked so hard to achieve. The only cure for this problem is to reset the neck (I reckon half of the vintage Martins i have seen have had the neck reset!). Perveresely. the manufacturers can't even beef up the construction of the guitar to help to avoid these last two problems, as the guitar needs to be of light construction to respond correctly to the vibration of the strings! It's difficult to say the least. A job for a good luthier with all the correct tools and materials to hand in my opinion.

ICBM · July 2014

The nut looks slightly too high to me, but it's hard to be sure from the pic. Fret each string at the 3rd fret and look at the gap between the string and the 1st fret. It should be less than 1/4 of the string diameter, preferably even less than that. (But first, give the strings a hard press just in front of the nut - you can see the low E is still new and hasn't 'formed' correctly and is still bending upwards in front of the nut, so the action is higher than it needs to be there.)

Next check the relief - hold the guitar in the playing position and fret the G string at the 1st fret and the first which is over the body (usually 15th). Have a look at the gap between the string and the 7th-8th frets. It should be less than the string diameter and preferably less than about half it.

*Now* if those things are right and the action still seems too high, measure it and/or consider reducing the bridge height. But don't do that until you have the nut and the relief right, or the measurement is meaningless and lowering the bridge could cause problems - and unlike an electric, you can't easily raise the bridge again. Shims are really a bit of a bodge, if they can be avoided.

Remember that acoustics must always have a higher action than electrics though, since for the top to vibrate - which moves the bridge up and down - there must always be more space under the strings or they'll hit the frets when the bridge is at its lowest point. You will also find that the tone on an acoustic starts to suffer before the point of obvious string rattle if you lower the action below the 'sweet spot', whereas electrics don't so much.

SimonC · July 2014

If you bought it from Richard, all their guitars receive a pro set-up before they are sent out.

Might be worth giving him a call if you aren't happy.

I bought an acoustic from there a few years ago, and it was perfectly set up when I received it

ESBlonde · July 2014

SimonC said:

If you bought it from Richard, all their guitars receive a pro set-up before they are sent out.
Might be worth giving him a call if you aren't happy.
I bought an acoustic from there a few years ago, and it was perfectly set up when I received it

That /\ , Richard does pride himself on his service and you should give him the chance to satisfy you with your new purchase.

Also ICBM said "Remember that acoustics must always have a higher action than electrics though, since for the top to vibrate - which moves the bridge up and down - there must always be more space under the strings or they'll hit the frets when the bridge is at its lowest point. You will also find that the tone on an acoustic starts to suffer before the point of obvious string rattle if you lower the action below the 'sweet spot', whereas electrics don't so much."

Which is also very true. You say this is your first acoustic, It won't play like an electric of course but it should be playable without pulling onto the frets and being out of tune up the neck. It's difficult to judge the action at the 12th but it looks a little greater than the string gauge. Talk to Richard first.

Dave_Mc · July 2014

ESBlonde said:

Richard does pride himself on his service and you should give him the chance to satisfy you

Personally I think I might pass on that... >:D<

Unorthodox · July 2014

Thanks for the replies and wealth of information everyone

.

I measured the action with a steel ruler at the 12th and it's ~3mm which seems to be fairly normal.

I think it was just a case of not being use to an acoustic after only having electrics in the past. I've been playing it the last few days and been having a blast.

SimonC · July 2014

When you go back to the electric, you'll probably find it feels like it plays like "buttah".

MDKV · July 2014

Look at the neck angle too. If you have a long straight edge / rule run it on the upper frets and point it towards the bridge. It should be hitting around the saddle.

Wrong:

Right:

nickp · July 2014

If I were you I'd take it to a good (trusted) guitar tech and ask him to have a look. If it is fine then he/she will tell you and if it needs some "fettling" and it will be the best £40 that you will ever spend on the guitar

also discuss string gauges with them.

I thought all acoustic guitars were really hard to play until I had mine sorted. now it is brilliant.

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Newbie action question

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