Audiosprockets ToneDexter

TimmyO · June 2017

Looks cool : http://audiosprockets.com/how-does-it-work/

seems like it is effectively for making your own multiple IRs from your guitars/mics and saving them into the device - so kind of an Aura plus IR generator tool

digitalscream · June 2017

Interesting indeed. I suspect there's a little Kemper-like technology in there somewhere.

Winny_Pooh · June 2017

Looks great, like a kemper for acoustics with EQ & a tuner. If it works really well you could even get away with a shitty passive undersaddle pickup instead of a mic blender. John Jorgenson seems to be using one too.

Only avail in the US at the moment.

Lewy · June 2017

Winny_Pooh said:

If it works really well you could even get away with a shitty passive undersaddle pickup instead of a mic blender.

If it works like any other IR based system, then a shitty passive under saddle pickup is precisely what you will need. Anything that does more (like picking up body resonance) will likely not work very well - artificially restored resonance on top of real resonance - bad combo.

I see two challenges for someone looking at this who may have recently ...oh I don't know.... splurged on an exquisite single-luthier build guitar using amazing tone woods (naming no names

)

1) All of the transfer of vibration from string to soundboard will now be going through a layer of ceramic. If that was a good way to preserve and maximise the resonance and tone of an instrument, luthiers would be putting ceramic shims on the bottom of their saddles. But they don't. Because it isn't. It's a marginal thing, but a fine instrument is fine because of all the marginal things working together.

2) The completely faithful recreation of your guitar's acoustic sound is often the last thing you want in a real plugged in scenario. Not the same as a Kemper, where the exact recreation of an amp is exactly what you want. More often than not on plugged-in acoustic, you'll want at least a bit of a bump in the bass, and then potentially some other more extreme EQ things depending on the room, audience etc. Additionally, an approach that aims to restore the ambience between guitar and ear, doesn't take into account that there is another layer of ambience on top of that (i.e. from PA speaker to ear) once it's used live. I've found that this creates a "one step removed" kind of feeling when you're playing which is weird and off-putting. This is based on live experience with Fishman Aura, and testing with iRig Acoustic Live and laptop running IRs.

So things like the ToneDexter seem to me to be the over-complex chasing the largely unusable. I can appreciate why the acoustic forumati would get excited about it, but half of those guys don't leave the house (to play or otherwise!)

John Jorgenson is an awesome player - an advocate of the D-Tar Mama Bear which is an earlier realisation of this general approach, but on the road he plays Takamines with piezo pickups and they are nowhere near the acoustic tone quality of your latest squeeze @TimmyO.

Winny_Pooh · June 2017

If you can get away with a contact piezo then all the better.

Re Jorgenson, unless you have been living in a cave you do realise that he is one of the planet's shit hottest django jazz guitarists and a tone nut.

Lewy · June 2017

Winny_Pooh said:

If you can get away with a contact piezo then all the better.

Re Jorgenson, unless you have been living in a cave you do realise that he is one of the planet's shit hottest django jazz guitarists and a tone nut.

I do realise.

But for plugged-in flat top acoustic playing, he uses guitars of unexceptional acoustic tonal quality. So sticking something under the saddle on that in the pursuit of a good plugged in sound is not really a big deal - I suspect that when he's indulging his inherent tone-houndery at home or in the studio, it's not on one of those guitars DI'd.

TimmyO · June 2017

Lewy said:

Winny_Pooh said:

If it works really well you could even get away with a shitty passive undersaddle pickup instead of a mic blender.

If it works like any other IR based system, then a shitty passive under saddle pickup is precisely what you will need. Anything that does more (like picking up body resonance) will likely not work very well - artificially restored resonance on top of real resonance - bad combo.

I see two challenges for someone looking at this who may have recently ...oh I don't know.... splurged on an exquisite single-luthier build guitar using amazing tone woods (naming no names )

1) All of the transfer of vibration from string to soundboard will now be going through a layer of ceramic. If that was a good way to preserve and maximise the resonance and tone of an instrument, luthiers would be putting ceramic shims on the bottom of their saddles. But they don't. Because it isn't. It's a marginal thing, but a fine instrument is fine because of all the marginal things working together.

Worry not - the extent of my navel-gazing over amplified sound is limited to less obtrusive things (K&K/iRig/iSolo/McIntyre Feather/Soundhole) for similar reasons.

I just stumbled across this and hadn't heard of it and thought it worth sharing :-)

For the open mic I plan on doing I reckon I'd get away with 1) plugging in an acoustic preamp unit/pedal and 2) about a minute of EQ tweaking before getting 'the frown' so I'm starting to think that a K&K is the simplest bet (the builder recommends the McIntyre Feather which seems to be a similar beast but only available in the US - although I do have a mate living in SF at the mo...)

Add a Fishman/Baggs preamp/eq pedal and make that work perhaps.

guitarfishbay · June 2017

This is a cool concept

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